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bear23

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OK my heads about to blow.

Last took the ex back to court for access to see my daughter.

But

She still continues to control mine and my daughters relationship.
By this I mean

I'm not allowed to call my daughter and my daughter isn't allowed to call me.

In the past when calls have happened the mother is always there whispering telling my daughter what to say. If I ask what has my daughter been doing mother will step in start shouting stop asking what she has been doing.

My daughter is 11 it's ridiculous shes not a baby. Why is she doing this.

I've had some issues recently which I've had to discuss with the mother about my daughters clothing looking shabby and old.
The mother receive £700 a month chold maintenance. Mom looks a million dollars daughter looks disowned when she comes to me after school so as a father yes I questioned where is my money going.

This as you can imagine caused an uproar. Since then it's I'm emotionally abusing my daughter my daughter is scared of etc... no idea where all this has come from I know its lies because its what she does when confronted with certain things.

Daughter told me her inhalers are out of date so recently I've had to fight to see my daughters medical records the mom tried to stop that telling doctors I've no parental responsibility after a long battle I proved I do then accessed her records to find she hasn't taken my daughter for her asthma reviews 3 years.

There was even a broken finger that I was unaware of. Why make my daughter hide this when she sees me??

Parent alienation is going on so now after being told I'm this and that to my daughter from the mother I decided to not see my daughter and give her space and that I would call my daughter the following Wednesday to discuss going forward and if she wants to see me.

My daughter never answered and the mom text pretending to be my daughter saying this is your daughter there is nothing to discuss. My only problem is you work too much (new accusation)

I've not idea what to do. I'm 100% taking this back to court the mother needs to stop controlling mine and my daughters relationship I can be the father I want to be. Last time I saw my daughter she told me she didn't want to see me I asked why not she said I don't know.
I know parent alienation is happening.

What do I do?

I can't have a heart to heart with my daughter.
I know the mom is stopping this because the accusations the mom emailed are lies so I will find out by having this conversation.

Now this is the funny part I've been accused of being the worst dad by the mom and daughter is scared of me etc... but the mom wants to go away for 4 nights with her friends so all of a sudden I receive a text saying mom said you can pick me up on 22nd.
Isn't this messing with my daughters head?? Because this is messing with my head.

I'm the big bad wolf when the mother wants to drive a wedge between me and my daughter but then it's all yeah your dad is ok when the mom wants to go on her holiday for 4 nights for me to have her.

What do I do?










It's affecting out relationship
 
Richie1989 said:
What a nightmare!
Do you already have a court order in place?
Is the ex abusing the existing order?
Click to expand...
We do have a court order in place.

Every other weekend.

She doesn't say I can't see her but I get these accusations in my email from the mother.

**** was thinking about not coming anymore.
Distressing her.
Affecting her emotional well-being.
She doesn’t feel in a safe place to speak to me as I never listen to what she wants.
You have limited my access with her on the phone based on the fact I am affecting her
emotional well-being.
Doesn’t feel comfortable spending time with me.
I am stressing her out.
I have intimidating behavior towards her
Emotionally blackmailing/manipulating.
Making her cry and affecting her emotional well-being

All this since I mentioned the clothes issue.

Then with my daughter saying she didn't want to see me when I dropped her home I thought I've no choice but to listen and back off.

So that when I didn't collect her my Friday couple weeks ago explained to the mom to give my daughter space. The mother didn't respond.
I said I would call last Wednesday before the Friday I'm due to pick her up again to find out if she wants to see me
Which is when I got the text nothing to discuss and that she had made plans on my Friday I was due to collect her and that I can't say anything because I'm giving her space. Not sure if this is my daughter or the mom texting.

Yet all of a sudden I receive a text saying all ok come pick me up on 22nd so mom can go on holiday for Xmas.

seriously don't want to pick her up after those accusation and feel that I should keep away till it goes back to court.
This is messing with my head. God.only knows what it doing to daughter.

The ex even made my daughter go to the doctor to tell the doctor in a gillick assessment I think it called that she's cared of me and that is why I shouldn't see her medical records.
Mom wasn't successful as I think doc knew what was going on and granted me medicals records.

Do I stop seeing her and let court sort the mom out?

I've been told that mom is breaching as my court order states I'm to have a relationship with my daughter. I'm told mom is breaching as she's preventing that for that reaaon it should go to back to court.
 
My personal opinion is take all the time you can with your daughter and don’t stop as this could be used against you in court to say your not bothered. Also amazing time to bond with your daughter if she is feeling confused. I would accept the extra time and then use it as reason to get more time if that’s what you are wanting, but the main reasons being to bond. I would rip my exs hand off if she offered me extra time and I wouldn’t care if it’s so she can go out! If it’s cos you feel used and it’s not in the order you are wanting then yes these things need setting in stone moving forward but again if your daughter is struggling at moment use that time to bond. Prove to your daughter you are around and prove to your ex she’s happy being with you.
 
Absolutely - take the time. IME when you have a high conflict, hostile ex, don't try to confront anything or engage with her. Suck up the nasty little tricks like sending your daughter in tatty clothes, and don't react. She's doing it to get to you.

Keep things low key and focus on your time with your daughter. Don't communicate with the ex unless absolutely necessary, and then keep to BIFF messages and only about arrangements if they need to change. Otherwise - ignore - detach - focus on your daughter, do what you need to to ensure your daughter isn't adversely affected by this - eg keep sets of clothes at your house etc.

I wouldn't advise going back to court. She's 11. By the time you get to a final hearing, she could be nearly 13. She won't thank you for putting her in the middle of a court situation. Also this is obstructive behaviour rather than breaching orders. See your daughter as much as you can - that helps prevent alienation - and make sure those are good times. Bite your tongue if daughter comes out with anything negative or provocative.

Try and keep the ex onside - bite your tongue - be amenable - ignore. One day you'll never have to deal with her again - only your daughter,

BIFF is brief, informative, friendly, formal - as if writing to a business colleague. Keeps the personal and trigger points out of it.

Btw she doesn't have to spend the CM on your daughter - sadly the way the system is, she can spend it on whatever she likes.
 
Totally understand and I always have her at Xmas for 4 nights the mom can't be bothered with Christmas so I always make it special.

But things have changed this year. The mom heavily has been dripping poison in my daughters ear.
It has been very uncomfortable for my daughter coming to see me this I can clearly see since the mom has stepped up parent alienation. It's like a different child in the room.
The preciously found out my daughter has been opening up to me about how the mother has been treating her and there was serious consequences to this as her mom does hit her. (I've spoken to to child services nobody listening and because it's doesn't leave a mark the mom can) My daughter hardly speaks. My lord I've tried. When she does talk it yes, no and dont know answers and then it I don't want to see you when asked why she said I don't know.

The mom's messed up she causes parent alienation yet still sends my daughter to see me but not allowed to talk to me. Its killing me.

3 Weeks ago the mom told me my daughters phone has broke so don't try calling her.

My daughter comes to mine and sits with a coat on.
Eventually I get it off her to find she's has a phone in her coat that she has to pretend she doesn't have one.
Then I get attitude from my daughter.
She has to go with the mom's lies.
 
Sorry I just edited and updated my post above.
 
Ash said:
Absolutely - take the time. IME when you have a high conflict, hostile ex, don't try to confront anything or engage with her. Suck up the nasty little tricks like sending your daughter in tatty clothes, and don't react. She's doing it to get to you.

Keep things low key and focus on your time with your daughter. Don't communicate with the ex unless absolutely necessary, and then keep to BIFF messages and only about arrangements if they need to change. Otherwise - ignore - detach - focus on your daughter, do what you need to to ensure your daughter isn't adversely affected by this - eg keep sets of clothes at your house etc.

I wouldn't advise going back to court. She's 11
Click to expand...
I wouldn't advise going back to court. She's 11

So do you think if I go back saying mom's breached by interfering with our relationship as my court order states she's to encourage a relationship with me not the opposite then because she's 11 they won't send it back to court?
 
bear23 said:
Totally understand and I always have her at Xmas for 4 nights the mom can't be bothered with Christmas so I always make it special.

But things have changed this year. The mom heavily has been dripping poison in my daughters ear.
It has been very uncomfortable for my daughter coming to see me this I can clearly see since the mom has stepped up parent alienation. It's like a different child in the room.
The preciously found out my daughter has been opening up to me about how the mother has been treating her and there was serious consequences to this as her mom does hit her. (I've spoken to to child services nobody listening and because it's doesn't leave a mark the mom can) My daughter hardly speaks. My lord I've tried. When she does talk it yes, no and dont know answers and then it I don't want to see you when asked why she said I don't know.

The mom's messed up she causes parent alienation yet still sends my daughter to see me but not allowed to talk to me. Its killing me.

3 Weeks ago the mom told me my daughters phone has broke so don't try calling her.

My daughter comes to mine and sits with a coat on.
Eventually I get it off her to find she's has a phone in her coat that she has to pretend she doesn't have one.
Then I get attitude from my daughter.
She has to go with the mom's lies.
Click to expand...
Try and distract her into normal things, don't ask any questions, don't mention her Mother. Check out this book - you can dip into it - I found it incredibly helpful. It's written by a PA specialist

Co-parenting with a Toxic Ex: What to Do When Your Ex-Spouse Tries to Turn the Kids Against You eBook : Baker, Amy J. L., Fine, Paul R: Amazon.co.uk: Kindle Store

Co-parenting with a Toxic Ex: What to Do When Your Ex-Spouse Tries to Turn the Kids Against You eBook : Baker, Amy J. L., Fine, Paul R: Amazon.co.uk: Kindle Store
www.amazon.co.uk
 
bear23 said:
I wouldn't advise going back to court. She's 11

So do you think if I go back saying mom's breached by interfering with our relationship as my court order states she's to encourage a relationship with me not the opposite then because she's 11 they won't send it back to court?
Click to expand...
That might be difficult to prove as a clear breach.
 
It's just she's 11. Cafcass will take her wishes and feelings, your ex will bully and terrorise her into saying what she wants - Cafcass will take that literally. You could lose your daughter. You are being offered some time so take whatever you can get and give your daughter the most normal pleasant times at your house - it will have an effect long term. Carefully teach her to look out for herself. By 15 she could be voting with her feet.

Right now she probably daren't say anything or maybe can't even process what is going on. Just do nice normal things.
 
Yeah she has whole wardrobe at my house.
Ash said:
Absolutely - take the time. IME when you have a high conflict, hostile ex, don't try to confront anything or engage with her. Suck up the nasty little tricks like sending your daughter in tatty clothes, and don't react. She's doing it to get to you.

Keep things low key and focus on your time with your daughter. Don't communicate with the ex unless absolutely necessary, and then keep to BIFF messages and only about arrangements if they need to change. Otherwise - ignore - detach - focus on your daughter, do what you need to to ensure your daughter isn't adversely affected by this - eg keep sets of clothes at your house etc.

I wouldn't advise going back to court. She's 11. By the time you get to a final hearing, she could be nearly 13. She won't thank you for putting her in the middle of a court situation. Also this is obstructive behaviour rather than breaching orders. See your daughter as much as you can - that helps prevent alienation - and make sure those are good times. Bite your tongue if daughter comes out with anything negative or provocative.

Try and keep the ex onside - bite your tongue - be amenable - ignore. One day you'll never have to deal with her again - only your daughter,

BIFF is brief, informative, friendly, formal - as if writing to a business colleague. Keeps the personal and trigger points out of it.

Btw she doesn't have to spend the CM on your daughter - sadly the way the system is, she can spend it on whatever she likes.
Click to expand...
Parent alienation has been going on for years and I pick her up without fail and keep is friendly with the mom. Regardless of the mom being hostile towards me.

But it has stepped up now my daughters older it's like she can manipulate more now she's older. It's working.

Yeah frustrating about the csa. Very sad.
My daughter walking around like that whilst her mom's face if full of botox and wearing all lovely clothes and has her hair done my extra cash really helps. My daughters hair comes knotted up she's mixed race it need attention so I sort it every 2 weeks as mom won't.
 
I'm not completely saying - don't go back to court - but you need more I think.
 
bear23 said:
Yeah she has whole wardrobe at my house.

Parent alienation has been going on for years and I pick her up without fail and keep is friendly with the mom. Regardless of the mom being hostile towards me.

But it has stepped up now my daughters older it's like she can manipulate more now she's older. It's working.

Yeah frustrating about the csa. Very sad.
My daughter walking around like that whilst her mom's face if full of botox and wearing all lovely clothes and has her hair done my extra cash really helps. My daughters hair comes knotted up she's mixed race it need attention so I sort it every 2 weeks as mom won't.
Click to expand...
My son was quite alienated at one point and semi alienated for a few years. I couldn't trust telling him anything sadly, he was trained to report back. Have a look at that book. Never react - always act as if everything is normal. She needs that from you to cope.
 
Ash said:
Try and distract her into normal things, don't ask any questions, don't mention her Mother. Check out this book - you can dip into it - I found it incredibly helpful. It's written by a PA specialist

Co-parenting with a Toxic Ex: What to Do When Your Ex-Spouse Tries to Turn the Kids Against You eBook : Baker, Amy J. L., Fine, Paul R: Amazon.co.uk: Kindle Store

Co-parenting with a Toxic Ex: What to Do When Your Ex-Spouse Tries to Turn the Kids Against You eBook : Baker, Amy J. L., Fine, Paul R: Amazon.co.uk: Kindle Store
www.amazon.co.uk
Click to expand...
Never ask about the mom it's more how was your day what have you been up to etc... those things are not allowed so it seems now.

Thanks will look into that book.
 
Ash said:
My son was quite alienated at one point and semi alienated for a few years. I couldn't trust telling him anything sadly, he was trained to report back. Have a look at that book. Never react - always act as if everything is normal. She needs that from you to cope.
Click to expand...
Yes my daughter has to report back to mum too. Everything. Apparently I'm the worst father for dropping her to her nanny's whilst I had to work on the Saturday the mother emailed me and didn't hesitate to tell me.
 
The book will help. Yep you can't ask any questions. You have to wait for her to volunteer information. Normal chat doesn't work. Don't react. Smile, do normal stuff. Every question to her is probably mental turmoil.
 
How did you respond to the ex's email? Ignore or justify it? She is harrassing you basically. My concern about applying to court is your daughter must have just started secondary school - she'll be getting her feet under the table. Your ex has probably started this now because of daughter's age.

Acting unpredictable can work sometimes. Hence don't react. As for the email about dropping her off somewhere when you had to work. I'd ignore that one.
 
Hey @bear23 ,

Really sorry to hear what your daughters going through, it's tough on Dad's too see their little girls being put in the middle by an adult who should be protecting them.

I second the book recommendation, I listened to the audio version and am finding myself going back to specific chapters when I struggle to manage or get caught up in the tricks.

Just on clothing etc, I've found going shopping with my daughter, similar age, trained but not alienated, and building out a wardrobe a great idea.

It's helped with transitions for her to change out of what Mums put out and into clothes of her own choice and then spending time together.

Also, remember, you know how to bring your daughter up, so trust yourself, give her the space and if she says something you don't like, keep offering reminders that you love her and always will.

The phone incident is a good example where you can show her she can continue to confide in you, for example reassuring her you won't say anything then maybe grab a charger and put it on charge on front of her, where she's sat.

Lack of reaction, smiles and small kindness, provide reassurance and can help foster an environment that may act as an antidote to the negativity at the other end.

If you have PR, then make sure the new secondary have your details and you stay involved in school events, parent volunteering etc so that you are never far and have a good rapport with her teachers - this will help reassure you that anything he Mum does won't negatively affect her schooling without your notice.

Stay Strong my Brother 💪
 
Some advice I was given at the time by a parenting professional as well - which worked well. It was treat the situation with empathy. Ie your daughter is in this struggle and on her own - she can’t turn to either parent.

So just saying the odd little thing that doesn’t need a verbal response, let’s her know you care about her.

Eg I know things are tough right now - are you coping ok?

Ok that’s a question but she doesn’t have to answer - she can say nothing or she can nod - but she knows you understand and care and then it’s more about her than about how it affects you. So she knows you’re ok and she doesn’t have to feel guilty.

When I did this, my son visibly relaxed and nodded. There was then an unspoken understanding going forwards. He knew I knew he had to do and say certain things and it wasn’t his choice and he knew I wouldn’t be angry.
 
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