What can a court actually do with an alienated child ( over 12 ) who now absolutely refuses contact

[Scoobydoo]

Hello. So final hearing approaching . Expert phycologist filed parental alienation and will be giving evidence. Cafcass / guardian in the middle . Dads done nothing wrong however .. Basically well child is old enough etc . Usual cafcass stance ..

I am applying for transfer of residency based on evidence. The report ( expert ) amongst other thing. Misleading court .. disregard of PR for years to name but a few.

Truth is though even if findings are made what can a judge actully now do as this shit shoe has gone on 2 years and child is entrenched . Therapy even been refused by child ….

Anyone have any experience of this ? Reality says not a lot bar findings being made .. thoughts. What am I now fighting for ( albeit will not walk away )

 

[Ash]

If they decide a transfer of residence is necessary, the idea is that after even 2 or 3 weeks, the alienation should wear off and the child be back to normal. Sometimes they say the child should have no contact for a couple of months, to allow them to settle in with you and adjust. Other times they actually order reunification therapy.

His wishes need to be ascertainable, not expressed. So if PA has been proven then the argument would be that these are not his wishes.

 

[Scoobydoo]

Hello Ash. Thank you .. I’m just concerned the court will take the easy option and say walk away dad. We have made findings but … so sad. I’ve held in a fought … but feel deflated as cannot think what they could ‘force ‘ amd would that be good for the child.

Of course mum and cafcass are hiding behind wishes and feelings. Cafcass surprise me as the expert report is clear but keep saying no findings of alienation have been made. Let’s hope they are at final hearing. Is this possible ?

 

[Ash]

If you have a psychologist's report that says the child is alienated, then that is a higher authority than Cafcass. Because the child is 12, then yes ex and Cafcass will be saying - he can decide for himself. Do you have a barrister to represent you for the final hearing? That is your best chance of persuading the court there should be a change of residency.

 

[Peanut 21]

Of course mum and cafcass are hiding behind wishes and feelings. Cafcass surprise me as the expert report is clear but keep saying no findings of alienation have been made. Let’s hope they are at final hearing. Is this possible ?

It seems like Cafcass are determined to say PA doesn't exist. Infuriating and frustrating!

It's really good you have a psychologist who recognises the alienation.
My partner had a dreadful one who massively sided with Mother and sadly that ended with a 'let the kids decide' order. As you know yourself, it's not your child's decision but the alienators.

You're in a good position with that report. If you can get a barrister then do as they can do all the questioning and putting points across for you.
I'm crossing my fingers for you when the hearing date comes.

 

[Scoobydoo]

I agree there is a good chance but as said would that actually work. Child is so resistant . It’s so difficult as much like other dads on here I do put them first so the horror journey for them will end. I sometimes wonder if I should walk. ( I won’t ) i am represented yes . To add on there have been false allegations . Misleading the court and more alongside . Believe it or not I do not want to take mum down .. that will make me equally as gross as her but in my quest for justice and a relationship would the damage I could cause by staying steel be more detrimental. Which is the lesser of the evil. It’s giving me sleepless nights.

 

[Scoobydoo]

It seems like Cafcass are determined to say PA doesn't exist. Infuriating and frustrating!

It's really good you have a psychologist who recognises the alienation.
My partner had a dreadful one who massively sided with Mother and sadly that ended with a 'let the kids decide' order. As you know yourself, it's not your child's decision but the alienators.

You're in a good position with that report. If you can get a barrister then do as they can do all the questioning and putting points across for you.
I'm crossing my fingers for you when the hearing date comes.

I’ve followed your journey. It’s heartbreaking . I admire you for standing by him. . I really hope one day like all of us do that the kids see it ! . The system is so broken and contributes to the damage and I truly hope it changes in my lifetime . In a culture of equality ( no issue with that ) men and fathers start on the back foot with CAO and finances. .. we are slowly becoming the ones ball and chained.

 

[Peanut 21]

Thank you @Scoobydoo
Yes, extreme feminism (should always have been called equality) has infiltrated the system and likes to divide parents into hero's and villans. There's the poor victim mothers who try so hard to raise the kids and the deadbeat dads. Most people's minds can deal with a goody/baddy scenario. Ironically, just like in parental alienation.

 

[Ash]

I agree there is a good chance but as said would that actually work. Child is so resistant . It’s so difficult as much like other dads on here I do put them first so the horror journey for them will end. I sometimes wonder if I should walk. ( I won’t ) i am represented yes . To add on there have been false allegations . Misleading the court and more alongside . Believe it or not I do not want to take mum down .. that will make me equally as gross as her but in my quest for justice and a relationship would the damage I could cause by staying steel be more detrimental. Which is the lesser of the evil. It’s giving me sleepless nights.

Understood you don't want to take him away from her but that means giving up. If he is so alienated he would resist being moved they sometimes send the police to effect a change of residency. You're doing it for the child's own good. If he's enmeshed wiht his Mother's thinking or is too scared to disobey her.

It's up to your ex to prove she won't keep trying to harm him if residency is transferred. She might start with supervised time - if she breaks any rules (like sending him inappropriate messages etc) then she won't progress to unsupervised.

 

[bujanin]

I remember reading a piece of writing on Karen Woodalls site, a blog post where the mother had taken an extreme approach to aliensting two kids. Even when they were put with the father it continued through mind boggling methods. She had a cast iron grip on their minds.

But the judge (high court) and Karen Woodall unpicked it. It took effort but from memory once the grasp of the mother was loosened it quickly started to come correct. The kids in question were early teens.

I think your Q was what can be done to rebuild a relationship when the child/ren are seemingly unreachable to the non resident parent. So I'm referencing this to show that all is not necessarily lost.

 

[Scoobydoo]

Thankyou for all your replies. I will update. I just feel the judge will not have the courage as it’s such a controversial decision to make ( maybe just a little deflated after 2 years ) and if he / she does what would it look like.

Appreciate the responses and for sure will keep you updated. Let’s say the final hearing is ‘soon ‘ and I’ll update ( prying eyes ) so being vague .. prepared for more incoming though. I’ve had all but the kitchen sink thrown at me but nothing stuck as it all bull…

 

[Scoobydoo]

Hello again. May I ask a quick question. At the final hearing can the guardian ( who did have a barrister last hearing ) cross examine myself and mum.

I had a pre trial chat with barrister in prep for our statement / Intention and I’m sure she said this could be the case but not sure if my memory playing tricks. Only this guardian has shown bias and is actually dreadful at her job / role and seems to pro mum ( not that she has been negative about me ) but just will not consider influence / alienation even though evidence stacked towards it.

Just don’t want her pressing me ideally or her counsel ) as I dont really have much respect for her professionally as it is and I could give it away . Anyone with experience in this ?