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Split between Child Maintenance and Spousal?

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DC5

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Hi all,
We are nearing the time to submit a conditional order which will be followed by a consent order and a final order for our divorce. We have 3 children and are close to agreeing a single monthly maintenance figure.
What isn't yet decided is the split between Child Maintenance and Spousal Maintenance, we are being guided by a mediator who is conducting the divorce in an amicable and fair way.
Maintenance payments will persist for 10 years, but the CM element will reduce by X amount as each child ends secondary education or turn 18.
For this, let's say the overall maintenance to be paid will be £2K per month - other than the Gov website, are there any other considerations when looking at the split between the two elements?
Additionally, what are the other future events that can affect maintenance payments assuming we get to a final order position? Live with new partner? Re-marry? Have more children?
 
Hi @DC5 and welcome to the forum.

Just to be clear will you be receiving or making payments?

Usually spousal maintenence is defined as specifically covering the needs of a spouse in limited circumstances - without knowing your full situation - 10 years looks incredibly excessive & unrealistic.

CMS which is government defined is targeted towards the needs of the children, this does not need definition by a Mediator, if you look at the online CMS calculator you can see exactly what you will pay and also what happens if you have other children to look after in your new household

So a few questions, to allow others to help as well:
How old are your children, approximately?
What is the defined Childcare Agreement?
Is this sealed by court?

Hope that clarifies a bit.
 
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Thank you for the reply.

To answer the Q’s:

I will be making the payments. Ex “needs” me to pay to ensure she can obtain suitable housing and living std.

Ages: 16, 12 & 7

The 10 yrs comes from the youngest being only 7.

Childcare agreement will be 2-2-5-5 with some flexibility for my work schedule. Not yet sure if this will be written into our Divorce Agreement.

Understood about the CMS website. Mediator is there also to prepare all necessary docs & our submissions to court.
 
Best advice I got was,

- don't move out from the family home until you have a court order for the children
- Sort the childcare first, finances second
 
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Absolutely. So 2-2-5-5 childcare has been agreed but not legalised. Don't assume it will be written into the divorce, and even if it is, that's still not a Child Arrangements Order! You need a Child Arrangements order to legalise things. This doesn't mean you have to go to court, if it's agreed it can just be put into a consent order and sent to the Court for sealing. (This is not the same as a consent order for divorce financials). To have a consent order drawn up you both need a solicitor for a one off job. Yours to draw up the order and wording, and hers to approve it. Then both solicitors send a letter to the court, along with the draft order, and you then receive a sealed order. That legalises the Child Arrangements order. It's actually very quick and easy.

The finances sound very iffy to be honest. Unless you're a multimillionaire! Firstly, if is "lives with both parents" 50/50 equal shared care for Child Arrangements, then there is no Child maintenance to pay. You share the cost of everything between you and both support the children in your own homes. Sometimes an amount for Child Maintenance is agreed as part of the divorce, (which is still not relevant if Child Arrangements are to be 50/50) but that doesn't last for more than 1 year. By law, after a year, you can just go with a Child Maintenance Service assessment.

Spousal for 10 years is just ridiculous - unless your soon to be ex is seriously disabled and needs help with personal care. I assume she is quite well and fit? In which case she can retrain and get a well paid job - which she will be expected to do. All the children are of school age so she doesn't need to stay at home and look after them. The usual thing I think, would be spousal maintenance for about 3 years (possibly 5 maximum) to give her time to retrain and get earning again.

Assume all this is so she can stay in the former marital home? I am no expert on divorce however and others may be able to advise better, but I think you're being led up the garden path a bit.

The difficulty is - an ex probably won't agree to a Child Arrangements consent order, unless you agree to her financial demands. And even then, you might agree to all her financial demands, and as soon as the divorce is done, she goes back on the Child Arrangements agreement and then you're forced to apply to court to see your children. It happens a lot. Because an agreement means absolutely nothing. It's only an agreement as long as both sides agree. If your ex changes her mind overnight, you're stuck. She will claim she's the resident parent, because she lives in the former marital home with the children and you'd have a fight on to see them - and also need a good few thousand pounds to go through the family courts.

So yes we usually say - don't move out without a Child Arrangements order in place.

Although you might prefer to do everything by mediation, sometimes it does end up having to be done through the courts to protect the children and their relationship with you. You also need money to provide a home for 3 kids.

So I think the next step is to get a solicitor to draw up a 50/50 shared care order, and at the next mediation session say you have a 50/50 consent order drawn up ready to submit to the court for sealing and ask her to get it checked over by a solicitor for approval and say that that then legalises the child arrangements and they can then continue with the financials.

If she says no to that then you cannot trust her to keep to an agreement. She is likely to say no because if you have a Child Arrangements order, you're in a stronger position to say no to some of the financial deals.

I understand you want to keep things as amicable as possible however. But don't get fleeced and lose your kids. Even if you're still living in the same house, a Child Arrangements order can be written to commence from the time you move out.
 
Thanks for responses guys. You keep mentioned a CAO. I think this will be a part of my consent and final order… or are you telling me that this is different? Also, any idea what a parenting deed is? Mediator is advising that this is not necessary.
 
Maybe they mean a parenting plan. Unfortunately this is something many people think. That a final consent order for divorce will legalise the time with the children. It doesn't - it's just an agreement. The only thing it finalises legally is finances.
 
Hi DC5, appreciating you used the £2,000 per month as possibly and example but as Ash has said, your contributions certainly read as being overly excessive and generous. Is the ex not receiving a lump sum from the divorce?

I've just been in court in my Financial Dispute Resolution hearing and the judge indicated 5yrs spousal maintenance would be the best case, it's very rare to see spousal maintenance payable over that term and it usually 2 or 3yrs.

Hope that helps.
 
Jumper85 said:
Hi DC5, appreciating you used the £2,000 per month as possibly and example but as Ash has said, your contributions certainly read as being overly excessive and generous. Is the ex not receiving a lump sum from the divorce?

I've just been in court in my Financial Dispute Resolution hearing and the judge indicated 5yrs spousal maintenance would be the best case, it's very rare to see spousal maintenance payable over that term and it usually 2 or 3yrs.

Hope that helps.
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@Jumper85 just to check, with spousal in play, can it still be termed a financial clean break?
 
Jumper85 said:
Hi @MagicJ, I've been self-representing up to now but from my FDR, a clean break can still be achieved if spousal maintenance is payable.
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Hi.

It cannot be a true clean break if SM is paid beyond Decree Absolute. And, imo, such an extended arrangement leaves a bitter taste and can be a source of ongoing resentment.

I was awarded SM until one child turned 18....multiple years away. Only by the virtue (lol) of having to take the Ex back to Court for her resiling on the Heads of Agreement reached after FDR#2 did I succeed in also having the entire SM amount paid in one lump sum.

A clean break.

HTH, SS.
 
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