How many childcare days does a divorced Dad have to commit

[satheeshv7]

Hi

Me and my ex have been for the last 3 years and somehow managed to stay amicably and share our child arrangements without any formal agreement.

I have been covering almost ALL weekends all these years ( Fri - Sun ) except 4/5 times a year . Also when possible visit during the week or keep overnight. So in total i had 1/3 of the year

But this was possible due to the fact me been living in close proximity to my Ex wife's house since and it was my decision so I can spend more time with my child. But every weekend is becoming harder, especially since my ex not flexible to cover weekends. I'm also starting a new business so finding it hard with this schedule not to mention missing my social life for the last few years , etc but my Ex doesn't want to change this and threatening to go to court if i dont commit to every weekend except 3 times a year.

So my question is what is my right - Can the court/mediator order me to have more days or force me to stick with this current every-weekend schedule? or will they consider me asking for every other weekend?

Thanks

 

[Roblox]

Hi

Every other weekend is quite common with perhaps one night in the week. Possibly also half of school holidays.

Unless your ex has good reason she'll struggle to get you to every weekend.

Mediator won't insist. Court can make decisions. Idea generally is weekends are split so parents both get quality time with kids. But every situation is different depending on work patterns etc

 

[Resolute]

This is the reverse problem to what people on here have experience of going to court for. TBH, I have never heard of a court case to try and achieve less time with the children.

Only risk I can see is if your ex does not like the idea of every second weekend, she could try to cut you out completely. If she has to give up half of her weekends, it might be easier to give them all up and collect full maintenance.

If it is handled amicably, every other weekend should be easy to achieve. If it gets to allegations and contention, nothing is easy and Pandora's Box will be open.

 

[Ash]

I think the idea is not to have less time but to have a sensible schedule so you both get a free week-end. Which is why the standard that's ordered is every other week-end, one or two midweek overnights and half the school holidays. But as Resolute says, most Dads are fighting to get any time at all so I would tread carefully. It's good that it's amicable but if you can sort it out without court it would be better. I assume she doesn't want you to have midweek nights for some reason? Or is it you that prefers not to have midweek nights due to work commitments.

Maybe start by sending her a friendly email - keep it friendly. Saying something like:

"I know we both want the best for our daughter and we both have lives to manage as well, but I'd like to suggest we adjust the schedule so daughter spends one week-end with me and one week-end with you alternately, and instead has every Monday and Tuesday night with me to and from school. I think that will still give her a balanced schedule of time with both of us, but means she gets more quality time with you at week-ends and experiences some midweek time with me as well. Hope we can agree this. Regards, you"

It's important to try something like this so if you do end up having to go to court you can show you tried to resolve things first. Why do you think she wants you to have every week-end? Is she trying to cramp your social life in the hope you can't meet anyone else with all that childcare? Or does she just like free week-ends.

To be honest there is nothing wrong with the schedule providing both are happy with it and it shouldn't stop you going away for a week-end either as you can take your daughter with you. Think of it as being a full time parent with an ex who covers the midweek time

Having said that I can see it can get a bit much, a schedule like that. But it's better than no schedule.

 

[Ash]

Just to add, I would love to have my son every week-end!

 

[satheeshv7]

Just to add .. I am happy to have every weekend ( the weekend schedule currently starts Friday evening to Sunday mi day ) .. So I am fully occupied weekend and with no social/personal time during the weekends for the last 3 years . Now especially around this time, i would like to have some time for myself and most events or going out happen either Fri/Sat

I only want some sort of flexibility like I can take 1 or 2 weekends a month even just Saturday night and if I don't have any plans happy to have my daughter full weekend but my ex wants me to stick to every weekend is my duty schedule.

I do a long commute to work so impossible to do school drop/pickup most weekdays but whenever I stay home or work from home I always make sure to have overnight and do the school runs. But the problem is I can't commit every week to mid-day

 

[satheeshv7]

This is the reverse problem to what people on here have experience of going to court for. TBH, I have never heard of a court case to try and achieve less time with the children.

Only risk I can see is if your ex does not like the idea of every second weekend, she could try to cut you out completely. If she has to give up half of her weekends, it might be easier to give them all up and collect full maintenance.

If it is handled amicably, every other weekend should be easy to achieve. If it gets to allegations and contention, nothing is easy and Pandora's Box will be open.

I already pay full maintenance based on 0 days and am happy to do so. Yes agree she can cut me off but the only thing i trust my ex is a good mother and she knows me and my daughter is very close and won't ( hope ) cut me out completely.

She threaten to go to court if i don't stick by every weekend and the only issue we couldn't agree is she doesn't want to give up the weekend at all and I have to beg every time I have something urgent over the weekend which I increasingly find irritating. FYI in 2022, Except for 3 I had my daughter every weekend.

 

[proud_dad]

I would love for my children to live with me every weekend (and every day!).

 

[Ash]

Understand. I had a few years of no Saturday nights free. The difference was I was in a new relationship so happy to just stay at home and on the rare occasions there was a do, one of us would go and the other one stay at home and babysit.

There is no reason why, if you had a particular thing one Saturday night, why you couldn’t use a trusted, recommended babysitter.

It gets to a stage where parents need to see their time as parenting time rather than as babysitting for each other. For some people that works ok if they’re both flexible and will swap the odd night here and there. But you’re kind of stuck with what she decides. How do you think she would react if you had a babysitter and went out one night.

I could never do it - until I was in a relationship as that was different. We were both too concerned to leave him with a babysitter although if you get the right person and they get to know them it can be ok. Even then it helps if you get back early to see them before they go to sleep.

Is she putting restrictions on you taking child away with you? Because you could have weekends away with friends or family eg.

If you can’t do midweek nights then the only alternative is just have every other week end and half school holidays and that is probably all a court would order if you can’t do midweek nights. Two weeks is a long time for a child to go without seeing you and they could be affected or become estranged. It sounds like you just need a break from the routine though. Those breaks used to come for me with school holidays. My son would be here for a full week and that was much better than just a week end and it all got less tense and regimented. He would then be away for a full week with his Mum and I’d get a break.

You say this has been going on for 3 years so wondering how old your child is and if they are at school yet. Because it shouldn’t be every week end all year round. School holidays come round every 6 weeks.

If your child is at school then yes you need a different schedule for the holidays. If they’re not at school yet - well you must be nearly there!

I’ll wait to hear about the age before suggesting anything.

 

[Ash]

One tip though - is to try and look at it differently. Rather than it being this kind of competitive thing with your ex over who does what childcare. Maybe look at it as Dad time without the ex around . And a chance to see your child grow up and have a real input into how they grow up. There’s a lot you can teach/show them. What do you do at weekends? Finding new things to do can help. Also be careful your child doesn’t pick up on the frustration or they may start to feel unwanted or a burden.

It is really hard work till they start school though- but it gets easier - especially when they know more about stuff than you do!

 

[Resolute]

Just a word to the wise, once court is mentioned, we need to be very careful. I went from cooperation to arrange 50/50 shared care with loads of compliments of how great a dad I am, to hundreds of pages of false allegations for a hearing next business day. If a solicitor and/or dv agency get their claws into your ex, all bets are off.

Just highlighting the possibility and urging extreme caution.

 

[Ash]

Yep it’s better to keep it out of court if you can. I put up with a lot of stuff for years to try and keep things amicable. Chopping and changing dates - every Saturday night. Some of which wasn’t actually good for my son either who wanted more stability and routine. I ended up having to go to court when she witheld him for the umpteenth time only this time she wouldn’t be talked round - she had an agenda - wanted to move on in her new family life and be a full time Mum. I wasn’t needed or convenient any more.

So she threatens to go to court if you don’t have every week end? What exactly is she threatening? That you’ll never see the child again unless you do it her way?

 

[satheeshv7]

Understand. I had a few years of no Saturday nights free. The difference was I was in a new relationship so happy to just stay at home sand in the rare occasions there was a do, one of us would go and the other one stay at home and bavysit.

There is no reason why, if you had a particular thing one Saturday night, why you couldn’t use a trusted, recommended babysitter.

It gets to a stage where parents need to see their time as parenting time rather than as babysitting for each other. For some people that works ok if they’re both flexible and will swap the odd night here and there. But you’re kind of stuck with what she decides. How do you think she would react if you had a babysitter and went out one night.

I could never do it - until I was in a relationship as that was different. We were both too concerned to leave him with a babysitter although if you get the right person and they get to know them it can be ok. Even then it helps if you get back early to see them before they go to sleep.

Is she putting restrictions on you taking child away with you? Because you could have weekends away with friends or family eg.

If you can’t do midweek nights then the only alternative is just have every other week end and half school holidays and that is probably all a court would order if you can’t do midweek nights. Two weeks is a long time for a child to go without seeing you and they could be affected or become estranged. It sounds like you just need a break from the routine though. Those breaks used to come for me with school holidays. My son would be here for a full week and that was much better than just a week end and it all got less tense and regimented. He would then be away for a full week with his Mum and I’d get a break.

You say this has been going on for 3 years so wondering how old your child is and if they are at school yet. Because it shouldn’t be every week end all year round. School holidays come round every 6 weeks.

If your child is at school then yes you need a different schedule for the holidays. If they’re not at school yet - well you must be nearly there!

I’ll wait to hear about the age before suggesting anything.

She is 6 .. fyi my weekend with my daughter all these years is not just Saturday it was - Fri evening to Sunday afternoon and have no complaints and am grateful of this. Also, I made sure to see her min one weekday even if it was at least a couple of hours after school. One good thing that came out of COVID was that it allowed me to have more weekday nights during lockdowns etc. So in total, I had her around 150 nights/per year and more in 2020, and 2021. I'm grateful for this for sure !
Once we divorced I also decided to rent a flat closer to my daughter & ex to make sure I spend time and smooth transition for my daughter. But this means I was far from my relatives and friends and found it hard to keep in touch. I do take my daughter to relatives once a month at least even though it's a long drive .

The reason I came to this forum is since I'm also working on a startup on top of my day-to-day job I m finding it hard to commit every weekend and my ex simply says no to cover when needed. so I proposed to my ex that from 2023 I would like the schedule to be flexible like every other weekend as a minimum commitment and on top of this will cover/swap her weekends if I'm around and free. Also will try to see my daughter on weekdays when possible. That request didn't go well as she is used to this weekend routine and wants me to commit going forward with the exception of 3 weekends per year. Also tried to compare with others to say that many dads do 50:50 and it's already a flexible schedule and threatens to take me to mediation if not the court if i don't stick with every weekend schedule. So I was wondering if it goes to the court what can be the outcome or is it worth the hassle?


The only th

 

[Ash]

If she’s at school then you should get school holidays. Is it every other week end all year round? Presumably it’s difficult to take time off work for all school holidays, but with half terms you only need to take 2.5 to 3 days off to have half the week. Those 2.5 days are tacked onto your week end.

I can’t see how it could be 50/50 if you can’t do midweek overnights. You could do every other week end, a midweek tea time and half the school holidays- and have a video call midweek as well perhaps.

If there are school holidays you shouldn’t be having every week end - you should get 8 days without your child there at Christmas and Easter (and 8 with her with you as well). Plus split summer holidays.

Yes court is a lot of hassle and exes can make false allegations (means they get legal aid) and this can cause months of delay with supervised time only in a contact centre if she decides to be spiteful. Eventually it will get to a final hearing and an order made and you’re likely to get what you want due to the history of no welfare issues and regular parenting time.

It would be better if you can reach agreement by mediation - but it doesn’t always work. She can just say no to everything then the onus is on you to apply to court (if she doesn’t do it first.

The standard a court would order would be every other weekend from Friday to Sunday tea time. A midweek overnight (or tea time) and hard the school holidays. A week at Christmas and Easter, a two week and one week block in the summer and split half terms (or you could have a full half term each and one split half term - that can be good for holidays outside of the expensive summer holidays.

So what happens during the summer holidays? Still every weekend? It’s difficult when you’re working as well but sometimes we have big decisions to make. In an ideal world, both parents woukd work part time and share the care equally - if that’s affordable- which it sometimes isn’t. Not sure what the start up is but it sounds like you may need to choose between parenting and career to a degree. I don’t think I’d want to go down to every other week end if I couldn’t do midweek overnights. Unless I got half the school holidays.

I did struggle when my son was younger but relatives helped out a bit.

A court will only look at the child’s best interests and that is to spend significant and regular time with both parents when there are no welfare issues.

 

[satheeshv7]

So what happens during the summer holidays? Still every weekend? - Yes and i also cover 19 holidays a year in average last 3 years.
In 2022 only 4 weekends I was allowed to have one for myself. One of which I was very sick and on weekend she took my daughter for holiday & 2 of which was for my holiday out of country

I have fri-Sunday, most of the week 1-day school pick up and drop at night or keep her overnight and school drop off the next day, one night I do facetime. Al in all i somehow manage to see or speak 5 days a week and don't get me wrong I do this happily and am grateful

The only issue is every time I ask for a weekend off ( on average once in 2 months ) it goes into an argument and feels like she has control over this situation and doesn't feel comfortable asking permission probably feeling guilty .. so mostly I avoid asking and it does affect my mental state

I have asked a few times in the last 6 months about changing every other weekend but she doesn't agree at all and one option she proposed is to have my daughter 2 school weekdays in a row for the weekend missed. But it's impossible when my commute to work in London takes around 1.5 hours one way which she knows I won't be able to do so. So I am thinking to put in an email and say if you can't agree let's go for mediation or courts which I hate to do but I don't see any option. My question here is if we are to go to the court how will they rule? It seems they will rule every other weekend so I'm baffled why she is confident that I will not go that route. Is there something I'm missing here? She also works full time but it's very close to her house and school etc. I decided to stay around them since divorce to give my daughter more time and smooth transition since we separated but she doesn't take any of this into consideration

 

[satheeshv7]

Yep it’s better to keep it out of court if you can. I put up with a lot of stuff for years to try and keep things amicable. Chopping and changing dates - every Saturday night. Some of which wasn’t actually good for my son either who wanted more stability and routine. I ended up having to go to court when she witheld him for the umpteenth time only this time she wouldn’t be talked round - she had an agenda - wanted to move on in her new family life and be a full time Mum. I wasn’t needed or convenient any more.

So she threatens to go to court if you don’t have every week end? What exactly is she threatening? That you’ll never see the child again unless you do it her way?

Well, interesting she only threatened to go to court and said by doing this will get me to sign to stick with this plan because I have parental responsibilities by law. I know they get nasty if the court rules in favor of me but so far i don't see any indication that she will restrict my access to my daughter ..

 

[Ash]

I can't see the courts will force you to have time! Usually the ex is complaining that you're a bad Dad and don't have the child enough or you're a bad Dad and shouldn't see the child at all. However it might not look great if you're wanting less time than you have already and they may see you as an uncommitted person. The way it is at the moment you are equal - no court orders, neither has residency. You could argue for a shared care order (making you legally equal in terms of who the child lives with). But if it went down to every other week-end, then there is no possibility of it being shared care. It would be an order for the child to live with the Mother and "spend time with" you. She has a bit more power then. Mind you she's already dictating everything.

She is just scaring you saying she'll go to court to make you have every week-end.

Playing devil's advocate for a moment though - it's possible she is genuinely thinking about the child needing stability and seeing both parents regularly - so child doesn't get upset - which she can only do at week-ends if it's not close enough for overnights each week. She could argue that too. However, that doesn't explain why she can't have the child for two full weeks in the summer, followed by you having her for two full weeks in the summer, then a week each. It's only term time it should be every week-end. At half term you should have a week-end each and a couple of midweek days each - if you can get time off - that's something needs thinking about.

I wouldn't ever mention court to her - mediation maybe if you couch it as - to try and help us come to a compromise agreement. If you mention court she might apply first and then you can be on a backfoot.

So even if she won't agree to every other week-end, would she agree to splitting school holidays so you each have a longer period with and without your child?

If you lived nearer it would all be a lot easier. You could even do week on, week off then.

 

[satheeshv7]

I can't see the courts will force you to have time! Usually the ex is complaining that you're a bad Dad and don't have the child enough or you're a bad Dad and shouldn't see the child at all. However it might not look great if you're wanting less time than you have already and they may see you as an uncommitted person. The way it is at the moment you are equal - no court orders, neither has residency. You could argue for a shared care order (making you legally equal in terms of who the child lives with). But if it went down to every other week-end, then there is no possibility of it being shared care. It would be an order for the child to live with the Mother and "spend time with" you. She has a bit more power then. Mind you she's already dictating everything.

She is just scaring you saying she'll go to court to make you have every week-end.

Playing devil's advocate for a moment though - it's possible she is genuinely thinking about the child needing stability and seeing both parents regularly - so child doesn't get upset - which she can only do at week-ends if it's not close enough for overnights each week. She could argue that too. However, that doesn't explain why she can't have the child for two full weeks in the summer, followed by you having her for two full weeks in the summer, then a week each. It's only term time it should be every week-end. At half term you should have a week-end each and a couple of midweek days each - if you can get time off - that's something needs thinking about.

I wouldn't ever mention court to her - mediation maybe if you couch it as - to try and help us come to a compromise agreement. If you mention court she might apply first and then you can be on a backfoot.

So even if she won't agree to every other week-end, would she agree to splitting school holidays so you each have a longer period with and without your child?

If you lived nearer it would all be a lot easier. You could even do week on, week off then.

School holidays are already split 50-50 and in summer time 2 weeks and I still had to keep my daughter the weekend she covers as she needs a "break" ?
My commute to work is 1.5 hours and even if i have her school run takes around 40 mins to rush time whereas its half the distance for her so we both know its impossible for me to commit to weekdays unless i change and move jobs somewhere closer to her. So for the last few years, every time im working from home or taking day off i make sure to have my daughter with me but the problem is i can't commit a regular schedule

 

[Ash]

We don't see it on here, but occasionally there are Mums who believe 50/50 is best for children and want the Dad fully involved half the time. If you can't do midweek then she wants you to do the week-end parenting. It does seem unusual as most would want their kids there for the week-end themselves.

The way the court looks at it is this:

Quality time is equal - 50/50 - quality time is week-ends and school holidays.

Care time can be equal or unequal - either - this is midweek time during term. if it's 2 midweek nights each it's 50/50 (because Friday night is the week-end). If it's 1 midweek night with you and 3 with her then it's more like 60/40 or 70/30.

So that's why, if you can't do midweek overnights, they would normally order every other week-end with each parent, half the holidays, plus a midweek tea time weekly, if you couldn't do overnights, and a video call a week possibly.

 

[Ash]

School holidays are already split 50-50 and in summer time 2 weeks and I still had to keep my daughter the weekend she covers as she needs a "break" ?
My commute to work is 1.5 hours and even if i have her school run takes around 40 mins to rush time whereas its half the distance for her so we both know its impossible for me to commit to weekdays unless i change and move jobs somewhere closer to her. So for the last few years, every time im working from home or taking day off i make sure to have my daughter with me but the problem is i can't commit a regular schedule

Ok 45 minutes is the longest journey time acceptable for school nights. I used to do that twice a week. So maybe you could have one overnight a week? You may have to drop your daughter off early at school to get to work on time but they do have breakfast clubs. Or would it have to be ridiculously early?