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Court Bundles
- Thread starter Kyle
- Start date
Ok I think I've got it now.
How many times did you guy's submit a statement? There are statements in Section A Preliminary Documents and in Section C Statements and Reports.
Are these different? I've already sent the court a Position Statement prior to my adjourned FHDRA explaining my reaction to her allegations, a brief history of how we've got to where we are and what I am applying to court for. I also sent a statement prior to the Enforcement Hearing.
Are you expected to submit a statement for each hearing?
How many times did you guy's submit a statement? There are statements in Section A Preliminary Documents and in Section C Statements and Reports.
Are these different? I've already sent the court a Position Statement prior to my adjourned FHDRA explaining my reaction to her allegations, a brief history of how we've got to where we are and what I am applying to court for. I also sent a statement prior to the Enforcement Hearing.
Are you expected to submit a statement for each hearing?
Yes, but a Position Statement is an update relating to the current Hearing, and also expressing suggested outcomes of that particular Hearing.IME previous position statements can drop out of the Bundle; either because they are simply irrelevant, or because the other side, the Bundle's compilers, can see that by including a previous PS it will now undermine their changed position...
SS.
So if you have any position statements you've submitted previously they would go in the bundle as well (along with ex's position statements). But I'm a bit confused that you're needing to do a bundle and statements/exhibits for an FHDRA and not a final hearing?
Did the court ask for statements or position statements?
Did the court ask for statements or position statements?
You and me both!
The court has never asked for Position Statements at any stage so far which is now 1 x FHDRA (Adjourned till end of October while court decides whether they will require Fact Finding, or not.) and 1 x Enforcement Hearing. I submitted PS anyway in an attempt to provide early clarity (from my perspective). They were received and read as the DJ was waving them about at the EH.
My interim order granting me Contact Centre time requests that the Applicant prepares a paginated digital bundle, with an Index, in .pdf format, containing all the relevant documents, and must file it to court and all parties by email no later than 48hrs before the adjourned FHDRA.
This is why I suggested previously that the court might be looking to knock this farce on the head.
I thought I would add an update on the progress and effectiveness of my court bundle following my recent FHDRA.
I have to pay homage to the website www.ilovepdf.com it has really been invaluable and saved paying for anything by Adobe! You can convert Microsoft Word drafts to PDF once you're happy and paginate each page in the header with the required alpha numeric designator.
I was commended by the District Judge on the clarity and ease of navigation of my bundle. They seem to pay particular interest in the font, font size and spacing! (As if you haven't got enough to worry about!) I disregarded the rule of using New Times Roman with underscores and bold letters all over the place and just used Arial, size 12. No underscoring. No bold. No Bull****.
I found creating a table for my Index a bit of a headache so hopefully this helps guide others:
I have to pay homage to the website www.ilovepdf.com it has really been invaluable and saved paying for anything by Adobe! You can convert Microsoft Word drafts to PDF once you're happy and paginate each page in the header with the required alpha numeric designator.
I was commended by the District Judge on the clarity and ease of navigation of my bundle. They seem to pay particular interest in the font, font size and spacing! (As if you haven't got enough to worry about!) I disregarded the rule of using New Times Roman with underscores and bold letters all over the place and just used Arial, size 12. No underscoring. No bold. No Bull****.
I found creating a table for my Index a bit of a headache so hopefully this helps guide others:
| SECTION A: PRELIMINARY DOCUMENTS | PAGES |
| (i) Case Summary | A1 |
| (ii) Chronology | A2 |
| SECTION B: APPLICATIONS AND ORDERS | |
| (i) A copy of the Applicants C100, dated 5th January 2022 | B1 – B15 |
| (ii) A copy of the interim court order, dated 12th February | B15 – B25 |
| SECTION C: STATEMENTS & EXHIBITS | |
| (i) Applicant’s position statement, dated 8th March 2022 | C1 - C2 |
| (ii) Respondents position statement, dated 6th April 2022 | C3 - C4 |
| (iii) Applicant's position statement, dated 10th November 2022 | C5 - C6 |
| (iiii) Screenshots of social media allegations | C7 - C15 |
| SECTION D: CHILD CARE PLANS | |
| (i) A draft copy of a Parenting Agreement | D1 - D10 |
| SECTION E: EXPERT REPORTS | |
| (i) A copy of the CAFCASS letter to court, dated September 22nd 2022 | E1 - E10 |
| SECTION F: OTHER DOCUMENTS | |
| (i) A photo of me and my child | F1 |
| (ii) Text messages between parties | F2 - F10 |
Brilliant work Kyle, this thread should be made the basis of a resource. I take my hat off to you.
When it came to bundle content for me there was a significant amount of decision making to be done about what to include and what not to.
I had been the victim of some despicable harassment on social media. I was undecided about including it as evidence of my mistreatment but then decided to remove all hints of conflict to avoid being seen as petty, even though what I had been subjected to was in fact, a criminal offence.
When I told my barrister about these incidents, he hit the roof, he said it was not acceptable at all to be posting anything about me or my case to social media and because they had been referenced by the respondent in her contemptuous position statement, (as she tried to justify her offensive actions), I was advised to put the evidence of those incidents back in the bundle so we had grounds to apply for a Non Molestation Order as well. This decision went in my favour and now Mr's Ex is prohibited from making any comments about me or my case to social media.
Another decision that took some mulling over was whether or not to add a photo of me and my child in Section F: Other Documents. I took the plunge and added a single photo of me and my son playing on the living room floor with him holding onto me in a very affectionate manner. It had a positive impact and showed what life between me and my son is really like. Completely discrediting the shameful suggestion that my son never had any real bond with me.
Defend your honour at every opportunity I would say.
I had been the victim of some despicable harassment on social media. I was undecided about including it as evidence of my mistreatment but then decided to remove all hints of conflict to avoid being seen as petty, even though what I had been subjected to was in fact, a criminal offence.
When I told my barrister about these incidents, he hit the roof, he said it was not acceptable at all to be posting anything about me or my case to social media and because they had been referenced by the respondent in her contemptuous position statement, (as she tried to justify her offensive actions), I was advised to put the evidence of those incidents back in the bundle so we had grounds to apply for a Non Molestation Order as well. This decision went in my favour and now Mr's Ex is prohibited from making any comments about me or my case to social media.
Another decision that took some mulling over was whether or not to add a photo of me and my child in Section F: Other Documents. I took the plunge and added a single photo of me and my son playing on the living room floor with him holding onto me in a very affectionate manner. It had a positive impact and showed what life between me and my son is really like. Completely discrediting the shameful suggestion that my son never had any real bond with me.
Defend your honour at every opportunity I would say.
Bundle layout and details: Example of a Case Summary.
A1
IN THE LONDON FAMILY COURT
CASE NO: LN123A1234
IN THE MATTER OF THE CHILDREN ACT 1989
AND IN THE MATTER OF EMILY SMITH (D.O.B. 30/01/2015)
AND JOSHUA SMITH (D.O.B. 06/03/2018)
BETWEEN: JOHN SMITH (Applicant)
AND SARAH SMITH (Respondent)
_______________________________________________________
CASE SUMMARY FOR HEARING ON 07/03/2023
_______________________________________________________
The application before the court is in relation to Emily Smith born 30/01/2015 and Joshua Smith born 06/03/2018. The children with whom the court is concerned are children between the Respondent, Sarah Smith, (Mother) and the Applicant, John Smith (Father). The application before the court is for a Child Arrangements Order to uphold the relationship between the Applicant who is the father and Emily and Joshua.
POSITION OF APPLICANT (FATHER):
My children are being prevented from spending time with me based on false allegations of domestic abuse and alcohol abuse. I have never been abusive and I vary rarely drink alcohol.
POSITION OF RESPONDENT (MOTHER):
I don't want my children to have any contact with their father based on his history of violence and alcohol addiction.
Issues for the Court:
Should there be contact between Emily and Joshua and their father and if so, how?
IN THE LONDON FAMILY COURT
CASE NO: LN123A1234
IN THE MATTER OF THE CHILDREN ACT 1989
AND IN THE MATTER OF EMILY SMITH (D.O.B. 30/01/2015)
AND JOSHUA SMITH (D.O.B. 06/03/2018)
BETWEEN: JOHN SMITH (Applicant)
AND SARAH SMITH (Respondent)
_______________________________________________________
CASE SUMMARY FOR HEARING ON 07/03/2023
_______________________________________________________
The application before the court is in relation to Emily Smith born 30/01/2015 and Joshua Smith born 06/03/2018. The children with whom the court is concerned are children between the Respondent, Sarah Smith, (Mother) and the Applicant, John Smith (Father). The application before the court is for a Child Arrangements Order to uphold the relationship between the Applicant who is the father and Emily and Joshua.
POSITION OF APPLICANT (FATHER):
My children are being prevented from spending time with me based on false allegations of domestic abuse and alcohol abuse. I have never been abusive and I vary rarely drink alcohol.
POSITION OF RESPONDENT (MOTHER):
I don't want my children to have any contact with their father based on his history of violence and alcohol addiction.
Issues for the Court:
Should there be contact between Emily and Joshua and their father and if so, how?
Sorry to hijack this thread but it’s sort of relevant:
The last interim order asked for updating statements of no more than 5 pages.
It says in the next paragraph that
“The father's solicitors shall prepare the bundles for the next hearing, including a witness bundle for the
final hearing.”
What is meant by bundles (plural)? What is a witness bundle? Is it separate to the updating statement? Is the updating statement in the Witness Bundle? Or in another of the bundles referred to?
I was under the impression that there was just one bundle but it appears not…
I have a solicitor but I’m trying to do as much as I can before I send her my drafts. To minimise costs.
Thanks.
I’ve no idea how I can possible include all the silly stuff my child’s mother has done since the last hearing within 5 pages. Plus include a cover and signature page. Plus outline my detailed proposed schedule of progressing overnights (which in itself takes up 3 pages!).
Plus I submitted a C2 since then and have a Specific Issues Order (surname change) to discuss as well
The last interim order asked for updating statements of no more than 5 pages.
It says in the next paragraph that
“The father's solicitors shall prepare the bundles for the next hearing, including a witness bundle for the
final hearing.”
What is meant by bundles (plural)? What is a witness bundle? Is it separate to the updating statement? Is the updating statement in the Witness Bundle? Or in another of the bundles referred to?
I was under the impression that there was just one bundle but it appears not…
I have a solicitor but I’m trying to do as much as I can before I send her my drafts. To minimise costs.
Thanks.
I’ve no idea how I can possible include all the silly stuff my child’s mother has done since the last hearing within 5 pages. Plus include a cover and signature page. Plus outline my detailed proposed schedule of progressing overnights (which in itself takes up 3 pages!).
Plus I submitted a C2 since then and have a Specific Issues Order (surname change) to discuss as well
This has come up a few times recently. Courts referring to bundles plural instead of the bundle for final hearing. I think it must be a fairly new thing that they want bundles of documents at more than one hearing. But from what you've said above:
You do a 5 page updating statement for the next hearing. Your solicitor is responsible for statements and any other documents being asked for to be submitted to the court (eg hair strand tests or anything else that was requested).
The solicitor is then also responsible for the bundle "proper" for the final hearing. The "witness" bundle will be the bundle for final hearing, to include both witness statements.
As they're asking for updating statements before the next hearing it sounds like they want a kind of bundle for that hearing too - possibly with both sides statements, and any other documents asked for.
You do a 5 page updating statement for the next hearing. Your solicitor is responsible for statements and any other documents being asked for to be submitted to the court (eg hair strand tests or anything else that was requested).
The solicitor is then also responsible for the bundle "proper" for the final hearing. The "witness" bundle will be the bundle for final hearing, to include both witness statements.
As they're asking for updating statements before the next hearing it sounds like they want a kind of bundle for that hearing too - possibly with both sides statements, and any other documents asked for.
I could be wrong but I believe there is one big bundle which includes all the bundles as one when it comes to hearings.
For example when my partner first started this nightmare journey in 2019 there was a first hearing which was the applicants c100 and statements.
There was a fact finding hearing 3 months later which had a bundle which included cafcass report, applicant and respondents position statements etc. By the final hearing 3 further months later it was a duplicate of the previous bundle as well as newer position statements. The mother had a solicitor who would have produced it all.
I believe everyone puts in their bundle (just a word to say all your statements etc) which gets put together in one big bundle for the judge. I hate all the court wording anyway. They use it to confuse the average person. They could easily change terminology into layman's terms.
For example when my partner first started this nightmare journey in 2019 there was a first hearing which was the applicants c100 and statements.
There was a fact finding hearing 3 months later which had a bundle which included cafcass report, applicant and respondents position statements etc. By the final hearing 3 further months later it was a duplicate of the previous bundle as well as newer position statements. The mother had a solicitor who would have produced it all.
I believe everyone puts in their bundle (just a word to say all your statements etc) which gets put together in one big bundle for the judge. I hate all the court wording anyway. They use it to confuse the average person. They could easily change terminology into layman's terms.
Right I think I might understand now. Maybe.
The next hearing is the final hearing. The previous hearing was supposed to be the final hearing but they ran out of time.
There will be a witness bundle that contains the updating statements (the updating statements are Witness Statements rather than Position Statements then? I have prepared a draft Position Statement that provides an update of what has happened since the last hearing - although I have to trim that down by 4/5 pages which is impossible. Should the updating statement be called a Witness Statement rather than a Position Statement?)
And there will also be a main bundle that contains all court applications, Cafcass letters and previous statements?
I hope this is all clearer to my solicitor than it is to me. I’ll just crack on with drafting my Position/Witness statement and trying to reduce its length.
I wonder if the detailed description of my proposed overnights and handovers schedule (3 pages long) will be deemed to form part of the 5-page updating statement? Perhaps I could have a heading: “Update” and then under the heading give an update of how overnights have went, incidents of the court order being breached etc. and limit that section to 5 pages. And then, a section below it titled “Proposed Schedule” that is outside the bounds of the 5-page limit.
The next hearing is the final hearing. The previous hearing was supposed to be the final hearing but they ran out of time.
There will be a witness bundle that contains the updating statements (the updating statements are Witness Statements rather than Position Statements then? I have prepared a draft Position Statement that provides an update of what has happened since the last hearing - although I have to trim that down by 4/5 pages which is impossible. Should the updating statement be called a Witness Statement rather than a Position Statement?)
And there will also be a main bundle that contains all court applications, Cafcass letters and previous statements?
I hope this is all clearer to my solicitor than it is to me. I’ll just crack on with drafting my Position/Witness statement and trying to reduce its length.
I wonder if the detailed description of my proposed overnights and handovers schedule (3 pages long) will be deemed to form part of the 5-page updating statement? Perhaps I could have a heading: “Update” and then under the heading give an update of how overnights have went, incidents of the court order being breached etc. and limit that section to 5 pages. And then, a section below it titled “Proposed Schedule” that is outside the bounds of the 5-page limit.
If it's final hearing there is just the usual one bundle for final hearing. They probably called it a "Witness bundle" because final hearing is when Witness statements (AKA full statements with evidence attached as exhibits) are presented.
But the bundle for final hearing will include absolutely everything to do with the case so far. Applications, orders, Cafcass reports, previous statements and the latest Witness statements for that hearing, plus any other evidence it's agreed can be included, that isn't attached to a Witness statement. But usually only evidence attached to a witness statement. That is the main thing about the final hearing statement - your statement is your evidence. The statement refers to evidence and the evidence backs up points made in the statement. It's quite an important statement to construct and ideally you spend at least 2 weeks preparing it and making it work with the evidence.
You'll be cross examined on the witness statement and evidence as well, so everything needs to be 100% correct. So they can't trip you up and accuse you of being untruthful anywhere. In terms of evidence - only include something if it's favourable to you. If there's something you want to include that isn't favourable to you - leave it out. Eg a letter may have some important points in but also refer to something else you don't want to bring up. So leave it out. Focus on things that support your arguments.
It can help to start putting together an evidence file as soon as possible - printing out anything and filing it - with sections - on various argument topics. eg emails to and from ex on breaches, emails to and from ex on difficulty making arrangements, emails from ex showing obstruction and hostility, GP letter contradicting something ex told you in an email (plus the email). To show she is posturing and not reliable or child focused.
Generally though it wants to have positive arguments for your life with the children, their home with you, what they enjoy their, extended friends and family there.
But the bundle for final hearing will include absolutely everything to do with the case so far. Applications, orders, Cafcass reports, previous statements and the latest Witness statements for that hearing, plus any other evidence it's agreed can be included, that isn't attached to a Witness statement. But usually only evidence attached to a witness statement. That is the main thing about the final hearing statement - your statement is your evidence. The statement refers to evidence and the evidence backs up points made in the statement. It's quite an important statement to construct and ideally you spend at least 2 weeks preparing it and making it work with the evidence.
You'll be cross examined on the witness statement and evidence as well, so everything needs to be 100% correct. So they can't trip you up and accuse you of being untruthful anywhere. In terms of evidence - only include something if it's favourable to you. If there's something you want to include that isn't favourable to you - leave it out. Eg a letter may have some important points in but also refer to something else you don't want to bring up. So leave it out. Focus on things that support your arguments.
It can help to start putting together an evidence file as soon as possible - printing out anything and filing it - with sections - on various argument topics. eg emails to and from ex on breaches, emails to and from ex on difficulty making arrangements, emails from ex showing obstruction and hostility, GP letter contradicting something ex told you in an email (plus the email). To show she is posturing and not reliable or child focused.
Generally though it wants to have positive arguments for your life with the children, their home with you, what they enjoy their, extended friends and family there.
Yes the Court Bundle is the collection of documents you compile to assist dispute resolution hearings and the Witness Bundle is the court bundle with the witness statement included. I was ordered to submit a Court Bundle at my previous hearing and I have to submit a Witness Bundle at my final hearing.
Bundle layout and details: Example of Chronology
• 18/06/1987 Children’s Father Born
• 21/02/1988 Children’s Mother Born
• 03/10/2015 Child Born
• 09/08/2016 Children’s parents separate
• 15/08/2016 Child spending weekends with Father
• 19/02/2022 Child’s contact with Father denied by Mother
• 14/03/2022 MIAM held with Mediator
• 20/03/2022 Application for Child Arrangements Order submitted to court
A2
IN THE LONDON FAMILY COURT
CASE NO: LN123A1234
IN THE MATTER OF THE CHILDREN ACT 1989
AND IN THE MATTER OF EMILY SMITH (D.O.B. 30/01/2015)
AND JOSHUA SMITH (D.O.B. 06/03/2018)
BETWEEN: JOHN SMITH (Applicant)
AND SARAH SMITH (Respondent)
_______________________________________________________
CHRONOLOGY FOR HEARING ON 08/03/2023
_______________________________________________________
IN THE LONDON FAMILY COURT
CASE NO: LN123A1234
IN THE MATTER OF THE CHILDREN ACT 1989
AND IN THE MATTER OF EMILY SMITH (D.O.B. 30/01/2015)
AND JOSHUA SMITH (D.O.B. 06/03/2018)
BETWEEN: JOHN SMITH (Applicant)
AND SARAH SMITH (Respondent)
_______________________________________________________
CHRONOLOGY FOR HEARING ON 08/03/2023
_______________________________________________________
• 18/06/1987 Children’s Father Born
• 21/02/1988 Children’s Mother Born
• 03/10/2015 Child Born
• 09/08/2016 Children’s parents separate
• 15/08/2016 Child spending weekends with Father
• 19/02/2022 Child’s contact with Father denied by Mother
• 14/03/2022 MIAM held with Mediator
• 20/03/2022 Application for Child Arrangements Order submitted to court
I filed my own bundle multiple times without any issue. I used an online software - cost £25 (a month - I only pay for the month I use. Mother's solicitor is her family friend, therefore always hides documents that would go against her. The software saves the all the files, so every hearing I add the new documents e.i court order and new statements filed. My last bundle is near enough 900 pages. Judges often used my bundle or both. Saves me creating new bundle every time or paying a solicitor. Ofcourse this only work if you're LIP, I don't think the judge would be impressed if you prepared it and that there are soilicitors on both side.