C100 - First hearing - Child over the age of eight

[you111]

Hi. I have my first hearing FHDRA for CA coming soon and on the notice of proceedings it says ' all children over the age of eight must attend the hearing' to which I'm surprised. My kid is 8 and I'm not really comfortable my kid attending the court and see the courts atmosphere. Is this some new rule? What can I do to so he is unable to attend the court as its gonna affect him mentally. If its must then how does it usually work? Does he sit in the court room with mom? Would he be asked anything?
He lives with his mom. Please advise

Thanks
Dad

 

[Altitude60]

Hi. I have my first hearing FHDRA for CA coming soon and on the notice of proceedings it says ' all children over the age of eight must attend the hearing' to which I'm surprised. My kid is 8 and I'm not really comfortable my kid attending the court and see the courts atmosphere. Is this some new rule? What can I do to so he is unable to attend the court as its gonna affect him mentally. If its must then how does it usually work? Does he sit in the court room with mom? Would he be asked anything?
He lives with his mom. Please advise

Thanks
Dad

Has anything been said about this ? I'm about to apply soon for child contact as the mum is refusing me contact my child is 8

 

[Ash]

Someone else mentioned this once and it turned out to be a standard thing and his didn't have to. Are you in England or Wales? You could phone the court and ask if it's the case and why? I wouldn't want it either.

 

[you111]

Someone else mentioned this once and it turned out to be a standard thing and his didn't have to. Are you in England or Wales? You could phone the court and ask if it's the case and why? I wouldn't want it either.

I'm in London. I spoke to my ex- solicitor told her that I'm not comfortable with my child going to the court and if the mother can agree to it so we can write up to court that the child cannot come. So we agreed mutually and wrote to the court that the kid wont be coming and also mentioned that he is got school lol

 

[you111]

Has anything been said about this ? I'm about to apply soon for child contact as the mum is refusing me contact my child is 8

I spoke to my ex- solicitor told her that I'm not comfortable with my child going to the court and if the mother can agree to it so we can write up to court that the child cannot come. So we agreed mutually and wrote to the court that the kid wont be coming and also mentioned that he is got school lol

Yeah make the application bro good luck. Don't stress too much about it as well. I don't understand why these mothers refuse the contact and start alienating children from there father. I mean its not really a good thing to do. Just keep your emotions aside and do whats right!

 

[Ash]

Glad to hear your ex agreed on that.

 

[you111]

Glad to hear your ex agreed on that.

I was surprised she agreed. She is mean and despise me but she probably doesn't want him (my boy) to miss the school I guess, as he enjoys.

 

[Ash]

I would hope it was more than missing school and the fact that it's really quite a difficult thing for a child to be involved in I would imagine. I'm quite shocked actually. For years solicitors were telling us - don't mention court to the kids, don't involve them - just say Mum and Dad have asked some expert people to help sort things out for you. Parents have been massively criticised for involving children in court and talking about it. It's totally bizarre. Alienating parents have been known to fully involve kids in court matters and "adult matters" - showing them emails, court papers and so on.

 

[you111]

I would hope it was more than missing school and the fact that it's really quite a difficult thing for a child to be involved in I would imagine. I'm quite shocked actually. For years solicitors were telling us - don't mention court to the kids, don't involve them - just say Mum and Dad have asked some expert people to help sort things out for you. Parents have been massively criticised for involving children in court and talking about it. It's totally bizarre. Alienating parents have been known to fully involve kids in court matters and "adult matters" - showing them emails, court papers and so on.

yup agree the kids shouldn't even know anything about 'court until they are teen. I remember when the Local authority in one of the our borough in London was going through the assessment with my children and the social worker was actually telling my child what 'by law you are allowed and must meet your father until certain age. Not sure why would they do that. I feel sorry for my child keeps getting grilled with questions with different social workers all the time (course in a subtle way). I might just give up

 

[Ash]

Don't give up - your child needs you and is probably deep down pleased you are doing something to sort things out for them - the worse feeling for them is feeling abandoned. Your child should only be spoken to by Cafcass/Social workers once and they are supposed to make it a relaxed friendly chat - often at school. I know what you mean because I felt like giving up once when my son was being alienated and under massive pressure. But what stopped me was realising I would be a) abandoning him and b) leaving him with someone who was capable of psychologically harming him. After the final order he said life was much better since the court order (he only knew there was a court order because ex told him!). And they get over things quite quickly.

FHDRA is an opportunity for negotiations and to reach agreement for a consent order. Are you being represented?

What is the current situation? Do you get to see your child at all and has your ex made any allegations about you?

 

[you111]

Don't give up - your child needs you and is probably deep down pleased you are doing something to sort things out for them - the worse feeling for them is feeling abandoned. Your child should only be spoken to by Cafcass/Social workers once and they are supposed to make it a relaxed friendly chat - often at school. I know what you mean because I felt like giving up once when my son was being alienated and under massive pressure. But what stopped me was realising I would be a) abandoning him and b) leaving him with someone who was capable of psychologically harming him. After the final order he said life was much better since the court order (he only knew there was a court order because ex told him!). And they get over things quite quickly.

FHDRA is an opportunity for negotiations and to reach agreement for a consent order. Are you being represented?

What is the current situation? Do you get to see your child at all and has your ex made any allegations about you?

No, she completely stopped in April the contact on stupid facetime which we don't really enjoy cz they are kids they run around its pointless.

The process has been exhausting I will just quickly summarize to you.
Separated 4 years ago post Covid, a court proceeding started in 2020. Because during Covid there were soo many outstanding cases that the first hearing date FHDRA was given to us was after 9 months. basically there were lengthy gaps and by the time the final order was made it was after 3 years (2023)

It was unsupervised contact which my ex- was against it , she wanted supervised! Not because I'm violent or a dangerous person I'm just an average man working in a white collar job. She just didn't wanted unsupervised cz she was just jealous and may be you can say a vengeance.

So I kind of know how the whole court proceeding works, In the beginning first year I was getting solicitor to represent my self and do the paper work but going forward I was doing the paper work and was representing myself (and mind you I was doing well ) Instead of flocking money to these solicitors.

So the final order was made 2023 and she stopped contact few months ago and made an application for amendment of CAO to be supervised (as per her children are getting distressed) She has been exploiting children (this was established in the previous court hearing) and doesn't encourage children nor say anything positive about a father. Basically she doesn't want the children to go to my house she is getting worried the children will enjoy and want to spend time at my house more.

So it took me three years for the CAO to be made going through the whole bloody court process, cost and all. And now she started the process again which is going to take another 2 years I guess. (So total years) Now another social worker will do the whole S7 report speak to parents, children go to the whole crap again which is why I'm frustrated as I was delighted when the Final order was made last year thinking finally this crap is over.

That's the reason I said I should just give up and concentrate on my life instead of going through the court process again for 2 years.

In a way I'm kind of stuck I'm fighting to see my children but unable to, so if I stop seeing the children the children would think that I abandanant them or mom would tell them see dad doesn't care about you or doesn't wanna see you (which is not the case). So I'm kind of stuck in both situation if you know what I mean.

 

[Ash]

And now she started the process again which is going to take another 2 years I guess.

Not necessarily. What was the final order for? Every other week-end, a midweek night and half the holidays? Did you apply to enforce the order? If she applied to vary, presumably that's why it's an FHDRA rather than an enforcement hearing. It doesn't mean there will be another Section 7. I think you need a strong position statement for FHDRA stating that the order should be complied with, and if you can afford it I would strongly recommend using a Direct Access Barrister for the hearing to get the best interim outcome possible. Eg existing order being followed, no section 7, or ideally, agreement thrashed out via negotiations at FHDRA so it goes no further and the order is just amended.

As a result of your ex's actions I think you should be asking for shared care/lives with both parents (not necessarily 50/50 time) which will show your ex she can't get away with breaching orders because she wants to. Have you made any accusations of Parental Alienation? I noticed you said she'd been exploiting the children. If you haven't, then don't, let the barrister do that or skirt around it in your final statement.

It could be sorted at FHDRA or if not, go straight to a final hearing and be sorted within 6 to 9 months. But I think it's really important you don't allow your ex to create delays at the FHDRA - which she will try no doubt. It's the delays that are the problem. Which is why I recommended using a direct access barrister for the FHDRA. Agree - forget solicitors, you can do most of the paperwork yourself. But a Barrister on your side could get this sorted and some additional clauses added to the order to stop this happening again.

How old are your kids by the way?

 

[you111]

final order was every other weekend unsupervised for 4 hours. And that also she got a problem and wants to to back to contact centre.

Yes its FHDRA for c100 to vary not enforcement. Cafcass has done their safeguarding and proposed s7 ofcourse as usual AGAIN. waiting for hearing next month.

It could be sorted it depends again on the mother lets see what her position would be I don't want this to be dragged. The kids are 5 and 9 boys.

Yes I know she will try to extend delay as much as she can, but I really don't want to spend a penny now on direct access to barister. I will grill her on the hearing I have attended so many hearing by myself and done well and became like Harvey spector lol.

As mentioned, when the final order was made last year she missed several contacts which I'm going to raise this in the court. The court didn't ask for any statements from both parties for FHDRA. So would you know how can I bring the breaching of order in the context here? I have enough solid evidence to prove she didnt made the children available for atleast 4-5 times.