I like your thinking, and it will take all my will, but yes, you are right. Question is,, if my case goes to fact find, do I mention at that point, rather than CAFCAS?
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breach or not breach, that is the question
- Thread starter NewcastleBrownAle
- Start date
Fact find is less likely if you are reasonable and non-confrontational. If the fact find goes ahead, you need to absolve yourself. Absolution requires nothing more than her failure. If she has nothing, nothing is needed from you.
Does launching a counter-attack make you look good?
There was a clear moment for me. I realised that if we both try to convince a court that the other parent is wanting. We might both succeed! This would have been tantamount to asking the court to put our child in care. I decided to cut my losses.
She got a run on me. It breaks my heart. But, fighting all out, invites an all out loss. My little angel was 5 when this started. Now my 8 year old is asleep upstairs and knows daddy will be there in the morning.
We spend more time together on an alternate weekend arrangement than my ex gets from her "live with order". You could easily get a better deal than me. My ex was bank-rolled by her family. She got several hundred thousand pounds in legal fees, and a property worth £400k plus, as compensation for the allegations she made. Her victory was primarily from moving over 3 hours away.
Coming back to your point, I believe that you just need to stay in the picture. If your ex is not going to be a good mother, your kid(s) will realise and will see you as the alternative. I feel closer to my child now than I ever did before. We don't get much time together, but it is time we both spend wisely - its precious, we want more.
Maybe I'm saying you do not need to win.
Just make sure you don't lose!
I get what you say,, defend rather than attack. Its just a never ending list of false allegations, an arrest, an NMO served, really plays the victim in court, sobbing,, butting in , denying any evidence that I mentioned that clearly shows she is lying, claim I'm doctoring the texts etc etc, the list is endless. The voice recordings I've got of her shouting and screaming at me, the wealth of evidence I've got that clearly shows her for her true colours. But yes, I suppose I'll just have to sit back, be calm, always child focused, always reasonable, it just seems an impossible task. But I do hear what you say and agree with you.
Please keep your recordings safe. The moment you use them, will be the moment she changes tack. It is only when a judge is about to decide, that anything so valuable should be spent.
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I've spent the last few weeks, gathering evidence to defend myself and also put the voice recordings ,dashcam footage etc in the cloud storage. During the NMO hearing a few weeks ago, whilst I was talking to the judge, she butted in and said that the texts I had , had all been fabricated. But as far as I know,, with iMessage, you can delete a post (leaving a deletion marker) but you can't add, amend or edit them, the judge looked bemused, but said any further conversation is by parenting app only. So she is clearly going to claim all throughout, that my extensive 4 year text history with her, and others is fake. Anyone had experience of how the court see this ?Please keep your recordings safe. The moment you use them, will be the moment she changes tack. It is only when a judge is about to decide, that anything so valuable should be spent.
It's not even about defending instead of attacking. You just present yourself as a caring Father who wants to co parent amicably. That is all Cafcass want to see and hear to decide that you are a suitable parent to have a court order. So many Dads trip up by being defensive or going on the attack when the way the system works is - they just want to know if you're a good Dad and a good parent. And to Cafcass, a Dad who criticises the ex is a bad parent (even if it's true). You want to avoid a fact find really or it could drag on for a couple of years with no contact. The way to at least try and avoid a fact find is to not say anything negative about your ex to Cafcass. Yes your ex may make allegations and they may be investigated but don't make counter allegations. This is where things go wrong. The court has one parent accusing the Dad of being abusive with a string of allegations - and they have the other parent (the Dad) accusing parental alienation. Who are they to believe? They don't know who to believe, so they have a fact find - which is only based on the "balance of probability". The Judge just decides who they believe - some ex's act well in court.
If only one party makes allegations, then it is thought - maybe they are just hostile but we'll investigate the allegations (Section 7). And if you present as non hostile, child focused and positive about the ex, they think - this isn't an abusive man. If you make counter allegations, the bizarre thinking is that the ex is right about you because you're being hostile towards her by making allegations. You couldn't make it up.
So you have to be smart about it. It's a natural need to tell someone what's happening and Cafcass are the first people you talk to. But don't - save it for a final hearing when you can present evidence. Don't say anything negative about the ex.
You have to get into the mindset of the court. If they see two parents accusing and fighting they think - this is bad for the child - give the child to the Mother to keep the child out of it. So the more you accuse, the more likely you are to end up with nothing. Being too defensive also can make you look guilty. Be calm, answer questions carefully - keep talking about your child, not your ex. Say positive things. Get that "good Dad" tick in the box from Cafcass. Let them decide about the ex. In a way it doesn't matter what Cafcass think about the ex because they know the child will be living with her so they are lazy about considering any issues with the ex.
The time to start subtly raising points about alienating behaviours, is after you have an order, if it's not being followed. First you need to get that order.
So I usually say - keep your eye on the goal - the goal is to get a good child arrangements order. And follow the steps to achieve that goal - regardless of what you think your ex is doing. Another thing people say sometimes is - give them enough rope and they hang themselves - you don't need to do anything other than be child focused, calm and present yourself as a parent who just wants the child to enioy happy relationships with both parents.
It's a highly stressful and emotive situation that makes us want to fight - but the court see it as a separated couple continuing their fights via the courts. Which sometimes it is - subliminally. Always be whiter than white, always come across as the child focused reasonable one. Don't say anything negative about the ex. Jump through the hoops and get the order. Let the angst and anger and worry out on here and by writing things down. And there is a lot of emotion to deal with if you think someone is hurting your child emotionally. He will survive it though and the best thing you can do is get as much time as possible with him by getting a good court order.
If only one party makes allegations, then it is thought - maybe they are just hostile but we'll investigate the allegations (Section 7). And if you present as non hostile, child focused and positive about the ex, they think - this isn't an abusive man. If you make counter allegations, the bizarre thinking is that the ex is right about you because you're being hostile towards her by making allegations. You couldn't make it up.
So you have to be smart about it. It's a natural need to tell someone what's happening and Cafcass are the first people you talk to. But don't - save it for a final hearing when you can present evidence. Don't say anything negative about the ex.
You have to get into the mindset of the court. If they see two parents accusing and fighting they think - this is bad for the child - give the child to the Mother to keep the child out of it. So the more you accuse, the more likely you are to end up with nothing. Being too defensive also can make you look guilty. Be calm, answer questions carefully - keep talking about your child, not your ex. Say positive things. Get that "good Dad" tick in the box from Cafcass. Let them decide about the ex. In a way it doesn't matter what Cafcass think about the ex because they know the child will be living with her so they are lazy about considering any issues with the ex.
The time to start subtly raising points about alienating behaviours, is after you have an order, if it's not being followed. First you need to get that order.
So I usually say - keep your eye on the goal - the goal is to get a good child arrangements order. And follow the steps to achieve that goal - regardless of what you think your ex is doing. Another thing people say sometimes is - give them enough rope and they hang themselves - you don't need to do anything other than be child focused, calm and present yourself as a parent who just wants the child to enioy happy relationships with both parents.
It's a highly stressful and emotive situation that makes us want to fight - but the court see it as a separated couple continuing their fights via the courts. Which sometimes it is - subliminally. Always be whiter than white, always come across as the child focused reasonable one. Don't say anything negative about the ex. Jump through the hoops and get the order. Let the angst and anger and worry out on here and by writing things down. And there is a lot of emotion to deal with if you think someone is hurting your child emotionally. He will survive it though and the best thing you can do is get as much time as possible with him by getting a good court order.
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Absolutely understood - but it is only within the private family courts, not publicly. And that is like being on a merrygoround - and a weird game. It's all about people manipulating the system to try and achieve what they want (or get legal aid). I know how it makes you feel to be treated like a criminal or accused of something - but it's family court, not criminal court.
The ex's usually throw everyting they can think of - mud slinging - aided and abetted by their lawyers - until a final order is made and then they kind of accept defeat - although can try and be obstructive sometimes but once you have an order, that protects you. No welfare issues with you. It's not an equal playing field as frankly no one seems to care if there are welfare issues with the Mother. If social services hasn't taken the kids away from her then she is deemed as safe. Parental alienation is not understood by many professionals who make excuses for certain things. Once you have an order and can see your child regularly, there are ways of preventing alienation taking hold but the most important thing is to see the child as much as you can, regularly so they're away from the negative influence for periods of time and can develop some critical thinking skills.
The ex's usually throw everyting they can think of - mud slinging - aided and abetted by their lawyers - until a final order is made and then they kind of accept defeat - although can try and be obstructive sometimes but once you have an order, that protects you. No welfare issues with you. It's not an equal playing field as frankly no one seems to care if there are welfare issues with the Mother. If social services hasn't taken the kids away from her then she is deemed as safe. Parental alienation is not understood by many professionals who make excuses for certain things. Once you have an order and can see your child regularly, there are ways of preventing alienation taking hold but the most important thing is to see the child as much as you can, regularly so they're away from the negative influence for periods of time and can develop some critical thinking skills.