Balancing life - New partner & Daughter

[Deakers]

Hi all, thanks again for your advice and insight. I'm working nights at the minute so I've not been able to promptly respond.

Its really difficult because on the face of it, me and the ex have a really good co-parenting relationship. We do get on in that respect. Its the mention of my new partner and any insinuation of life with her including my daughter is an absolute no go area for me. She doesn't seem the type to make false allegations, but at the same time she's done some things since we separated that I would not have expected or thought she was capable of. So who knows what anyone will do when they feel that their back is against the wall.

I do not have the financial ability to have a long drawn out court battle. So the mention of costs etc is scary.

My partner would be happy that I don't introduce my daughter straight away so long as there is an end goal. That is just something I've found difficult to provide for the reasons mentioned. I've been treading water with it for a while, and that's been the cause of problems too.

I average 2.5 nights per week. This sounds quite statistical but I work shifts as does my ex, so we basically have had the full year planned out, something which we settled on at mediation. At the time I was pushing for 50/50. This was our start point when we separated. This then went to 3 nights, then 2 nights (instigated by her, accepted begrudgingly by me). At mediation and after a schedule was implemented it works out a little higher than that at 2.5 nights. Eventually I said at mediation that I would accept this as the constant battles over time etc was draining me, no doubt my ex too, and was inevitably going to have a knock on effect with my daughter.
My ex doesn't think of my daughters best interests when it comes to arrangements, for example, I have most Tuesday nights and all day Wednesday, but then late on Wednesday she goes to her mums overnight to get up early first thing and go to nursery. I proposed to keep her overnight Wednesdays (which would boost time with me to 3.5 nights and 50/50) so that it was simple and less upheaval for the little one. This was completely shut down because my ex seen this as time taken away from her.

So basically the schedule isn't regular, but its all that we could manage due to shifts. Holidays will be split when we get to that stage.

Me and my partner only really discuss when the situation comes up about progressing our lives together. She has a son of her own who she co-parents with her ex. I see her son regularly and eventually the plan is that we live together as a family. Which shouldn't be as unrealistic as it sounds to me right now.

 

[Resolute]

You had 3.5 nights a week to start, then 3, then 2, now 2.5. I would consider applying for a "lives with both parents" order on a 50/50 basis. Basically, restoration of the 3.5 nights per week.

Even if you do not get the 50/50, you could still get the joint lives with. 2.5 nights a week is a pretty decent arrangement comparatively speaking. Just confirming that could be enough to get an order saying the child lives with you for some of the time, rather than merely "spends time" with you. This would put you on a more equal footing with your ex. To my knowledge, it would be much less likely if you were at 2 nights a week. Wait and see other members' views. Perhaps this is why your ex wanted it down to 2. Do you think she is getting advice from anywhere?

Maintenance could feed into this as well. Although it can be a nightmare to process through CMS. A true 50/50 arrangement would not require either parent to pay. Perhaps a fixed maintenance agreement would help smooth things along.

The thing about your partner need not be at centre stage. Assuming there is no safeguarding concern, an order would give you freedom to decide who is around the child while with you. You would have recourse through the court if your ex was unreasonable about this.

Most court orders lay down a regular and relatively simple pattern for the child. The irregularity of what you will be asking for may be an obstacle if your ex decides to try and make it one. The fact she agreed it in mediation could be useful. Do you have good records of how your informal arrangement has evolved over time?

I agree with Ash that the history should stop any mud that is slung at you from sticking in the long term. I believe a decent barrister would help stop it from sticking in the short term. Do you think your ex would have a solicitor and barrister?

My earlier post may have felt alarming. It wasn't intended to be. There are successes thought court for many dads. I just wanted to be realistic on how rough a road it can be.

 

[Ash]

I didn't quite follow the schedule. Do you only get midweek nights or do you get week-ends as well? I think unfortunately your ex will always refuse to have your partner involved so waiting won't make any difference. That is what I found. And eventually you just need to decide to just exert yourself by letting her know you intend to introduce your partner now (and if she stops you seeing your daughter you apply to court). Or just do it. But just doing it could put the child in the middle if she goes back talking about your partner. You can't make someone agree to something but the court can.

 

[Ash]

However the standard schedule would be seen as every other week-end and a midweek night. Could you do that with your shifts? Week-ends and holidays are seen as quality time and shared 50/50. Midweek term time is seen as care time.

 

[Deakers]

Hi. Sorry to dig up my old post.
An update on my situation is that I introduced my daughter to my partner. My ex was adamant that this would not be happening and said she would not allow it under any circumstances. I bit the bullet and done it anyway.

My ex has stopped my daughter from spending time with me and states that I'm going to have to take her to court.

I've realised that it's been longer than 4 months since my last mediation session.

Do I need to contact mediation to arrange a MIAM etc?
What happens if she ignores the request from the mediator?
How long do I have to wait to get a response from her through mediation before I can get signed off and make a court application?

 

[MagicJ]

Hi. Sorry to dig up my old post.
An update on my situation is that I introduced my daughter to my partner. My ex was adamant that this would not be happening and said she would not allow it under any circumstances. I bit the bullet and done it anyway.

My ex has stopped my daughter from spending time with me and states that I'm going to have to take her to court.

I've realised that it's been longer than 4 months since my last mediation session.

Do I need to contact mediation to arrange a MIAM etc?
What happens if she ignores the request from the mediator?
How long do I have to wait to get a response from her through mediation before I can get signed off and make a court application?

Hey @Deakers , quick Google:

The mediators add a date at the bottom of the mediation certificate and the document will be valid for 4 months from that date. So, if your certificate says 15 January 2021, you will have to submit your court application before May 15th 2021. If you take longer than that to make your application, it will be refused and you will have to schedule another MIAM to get a new mediation certificate.

 

[MagicJ]

hey

 

[MagicJ]

Hey @Deakers ,

Just re-apply, there will be services that offer a same day sign-off, Google a few.

 

[MagicJ]

Sorry to hear that she's stopped you from having contact.

Do I need to contact mediation to arrange a MIAM etc?

Yes, as above, get in touch with a service that states they provide a quick turnaround.

What happens if she ignores the request from the mediator?

The mediator will tell you and ask if you want the certificate

How long do I have to wait to get a response from her through mediation before I can get signed off and make a court application?

Not very long but be clear about what has happened as some mediators do draw it a out a couple of weeks, so if they do just be polite , explain what has happened and ask for the sign off

 

[Ash]

Sorry to hear that - it was inevitable, but you couldn't let her keep ruling things. Maybe contact the mediator, explain the situation and say you want signing off again as it's urgent now. They may say they want you to try mediation.

Personally I'd have another MIAM and ask to signed off on the day and take the page from the C100 with me. Which is what I did when contact was stopped. The mediator was quite difficult about signing it there and then and said no we have to send it to you. My application at the time was for a 48 hour hearing and I said it was for an urgent hearing and eventually she gave way. It's always urgent, in my book, if your child is being witheld.

However in the meantime you could try polite negotiation by email as well.

EG

"Hi. I am extremely concerned that you are witholding our son/daughter from seeing me and spending time with me. This is not in their best interests and any disagreements should be sorted out between us and not involve the children. Please confirm that x will be available to collect at x time on x day as usual."

What that does is give her the opportunity to reply saying - not unless you confirm your girlfriend won't be there (or whatever) - which is the evidence you need for later.

 

[Ash]

It also means you can say you've been trying to resolve things but to no avail.

 

[Deakers]

Thanks for the response. I'm going to try Google a few mediators this morning and see what I can sort out.

As per with any requests, I'm worried that me emailing formally to state my concerns will make her realise that I'm going to push this, and she will then retaliate making claims and attempting to build a case against me. She has access to money and so barristers etc are not out of her reach but are most definitely out of mine. Really worried at this stage about my daughter and her the impact of all this on her moving forward

 

[Peanut 21]

Thanks for the response. I'm going to try Google a few mediators this morning and see what I can sort out.

As per with any requests, I'm worried that me emailing formally to state my concerns will make her realise that I'm going to push this, and she will then retaliate making claims and attempting to build a case against me. She has access to money and so barristers etc are not out of her reach but are most definitely out of mine. Really worried at this stage about my daughter and her the impact of all this on her moving forward

Totally understandable but if you do nothing it could get worse.
When you're backed against a wall you have to push back.

 

[Ash]

Thanks for the response. I'm going to try Google a few mediators this morning and see what I can sort out.

As per with any requests, I'm worried that me emailing formally to state my concerns will make her realise that I'm going to push this, and she will then retaliate making claims and attempting to build a case against me. She has access to money and so barristers etc are not out of her reach but are most definitely out of mine. Really worried at this stage about my daughter and her the impact of all this on her moving forward

Yes phone around a few and say it's urgent and do they have a 24 hour appointment. Some will have. If you're concerned about putting something in writing, then send it the same day you submit the application.

However, if you put something in writing carefully, that isn't a threat and is just basically asking her to let you see your child/children that should not indicate to her that you're thinking of going to court. I agree that threatening court isn't a good move. Be more subtle about it.

So how about this then

"Hi. Please can you let me know how xxxxxxxxxxx is doing. I am very concerned that she is not getting to see me and hope we can sort this out. I propose collecting her as usual on x day. Please can you let me know what you will agree to".

That is simply asking to see your child, not threatening, and asking to sort things out. She might come back with "you can see her on your own for two hours on Thursday" or something.

If that happens, then take whatever time is offered but put your application in stating the reason she has prevented your child from seeing you (ie she wouldn't agree to your partner being involved and when you decided to involve your partner she stopped child coming).

I think what is more likely to make her retaliate is if she knows you're starting mediation and she is invited. That's an indication you might be thinking about court. So maybe send a low key message like above, get a MIAM and sign off and apply to court. Any allegations she comes out with then will be seen as retaliatory, under the circumstances. Particularly if you have a good history of regular time.

 

[DB2021]

Thanks for the response. I'm going to try Google a few mediators this morning and see what I can sort out.

As per with any requests, I'm worried that me emailing formally to state my concerns will make her realise that I'm going to push this, and she will then retaliate making claims and attempting to build a case against me. She has access to money and so barristers etc are not out of her reach but are most definitely out of mine. Really worried at this stage about my daughter and her the impact of all this on her moving forward

Hi Deakers.

I’m sorry to hear your going through this.

Im in a similar position to you but just a lot further forward I am always worried about “poking the bear” as they say but at the end of the day we have to take that risk because as peanut says doing nothing is worse.

The only way to change things is to stand up to these women and whilst it probably will get tough whilst going through it it’s what our kids need.

I am still struggling to stand up to my ex and I’ve been paying a heavy price for it but thankfully I do still get to see my little one I just have a lot of behaviour to contend with and manipulation by ex of our daughter.

Don’t give up and get your application in asap show her your not going anywhere and you will fight with everything you have they hate that as they expect us to just give up.

Keep strong my friend you will get there

 

[Deakers]

Yes phone around a few and say it's urgent and do they have a 24 hour appointment. Some will have. If you're concerned about putting something in writing, then send it the same day you submit the application.

However, if you put something in writing carefully, that isn't a threat and is just basically asking her to let you see your child/children that should not indicate to her that you're thinking of going to court. I agree that threatening court isn't a good move. Be more subtle about it.

So how about this then

"Hi. Please can you let me know how xxxxxxxxxxx is doing. I am very concerned that she is not getting to see me and hope we can sort this out. I propose collecting her as usual on x day. Please can you let me know what you will agree to".

That is simply asking to see your child, not threatening, and asking to sort things out. She might come back with "you can see her on your own for two hours on Thursday" or something.

If that happens, then take whatever time is offered but put your application in stating the reason she has prevented your child from seeing you (ie she wouldn't agree to your partner being involved and when you decided to involve your partner she stopped child coming).

I think what is more likely to make her retaliate is if she knows you're starting mediation and she is invited. That's an indication you might be thinking about court. So maybe send a low key message like above, get a MIAM and sign off and apply to court. Any allegations she comes out with then will be seen as retaliatory, under the circumstances. Particularly if you have a good history of regular time.

Thank you for this. I have just had a chat with mediation. She has said that I have two options.

1) book a MIAM and pay £95 to attend then see what my ex does (complies/attends and we move forward)
2) pay to have sign off today, £95, and apply to court

They always sow seeds of doubt. For example, she said it would be looked at less favourably from my perspective if i didn't try to mediate (option 1). So basically trying to dissuade me from going straight in with option 2.

What should I do?

 

[Ash]

Option 2

You can always say in your application that you are happy to attend mediation at some point, but have urgent concerns as to the emotional wellbeing of your daughter with the suddenness of her being witheld after x years of a home life with you. And that you have attempted reasonable negotiation but to no avail (depending on what happens next). I can help you with the application wording.

 

[MagicJ]

Option 2, as @Ash says, Mediation is open all the way to the court room door.

 

[Deakers]

Option 2

You can always say in your application that you are happy to attend mediation at some point, but have urgent concerns as to the emotional wellbeing of your daughter with the suddenness of her being witheld after x years of a home life with you. And that you have attempted reasonable negotiation but to no avail (depending on what happens next). I can help you with the application wording.

I've called mediation again and asked them to sign off to which they agreed. Just waiting for the certificate to come through as I'll be looking to make a court application ASAP.
Ash, I really appreciate your offer to assist and I'd be really grateful for the help.

I emailed the ex also stating when I was due to see her and that I'll plan to pick her up at the usual time, asked if this was ok. As yet I've had no response and I don't expect to get one either. She likes to not respond messages, instead calling me to make all kinds of threats where nothing is documented that can be referred back to.

Thanks again

 

[DB2021]

I've called mediation again and asked them to sign off to which they agreed. Just waiting for the certificate to come through as I'll be looking to make a court application ASAP.
Ash, I really appreciate your offer to assist and I'd be really grateful for the help.

I emailed the ex also stating when I was due to see her and that I'll plan to pick her up at the usual time, asked if this was ok. As yet I've had no response and I don't expect to get one either. She likes to not respond messages, instead calling me to make all kinds of threats where nothing is documented that can be referred back to.

Thanks again

Again snap with my ex.

They are very clever at doing things where you have no concrete evidence but make sure you journal everything every thing she does or doesn’t do and any times you don’t get to see your little one so you can time line things it will be useful at court.

Glad to hear you’ve been signed off some mediators like to think they make the decisions when they really don’t.

You’ve started the process now it’s time to get a very well worded application which Ash will help no end in and then just keep doing what your doing be polite respectful and show that your the child focused one which we know you are.

It’s a long road but when you get the little positive wins it’s worth every second of it.