Guest viewing is limited

Advice around the family home and breaches of trust

Sid0926

New member
Member
Hi, I'm separated from my wife and I understand that as we are both on the title deeds I have every right to stay in the house however I have decided to move out to prevent out children witnessing the toxic environment. We are currently looking at the finances and deciding who pays what and some of the reasons she has come up with for not wanting to pay one thing or the other I think is bonkers. To top it all she is saying she wants to turn my office downstairs into a bedroom and rent it out. I've told her I'll not be having a complete stranger in the house with my kids. If it was an annex to the house I might be more agreeable but this is a room in the house. She is saying without the additional income we will have to sell the house and then it will be my fault the kids are upset. My question, if I'm not in the family home but I'm on the title deeds surely I have the right to say what I want our house to be used for.
Apologies for the rant, this is all a bit fresh having hit me 20mins ago.
 
Hi and welcome. Don't move out until you have child arrangements agreed. It's the first bit of advice we always give. The finances, house etc can all wait, until you have something formal in place over child arrangements after you separate. A stbx wife always wants the house and financials sorted and you move out, assuming the children stay with her and she can decide if and when you see them.

What can happen is, once you've moved out, you have great difficulty getting to see them or it's all on her terms - ie only if she is present or for very short times. And while you can still apply for a child arrangements order then, it's harder because she can use leverage (ie withold the children unless you agree to unreasonable financial arrangements).

It is actually possible to get a child arrangements order before you move out. As part of your application you say that you plan to move out when you have found a place suitable, and once child arrangements are in place in preparation and meanwhile you are living in the same house as a separated couple and sharing the childcare, with you doing schoolruns, cooking tea on Thursdays, taking them to swimming club (or whatever you do). Which all helps show you are a fully involved parent. So an order can be set to date from the time you move out.

You don't actually have to go to court to get a CAO - it can be done by consent - if you both agree the terms - for that you would each need a solicitor to agree the terms, one of the solicitors draw up the order wording, the other one approve it and then it's just sent to the court for sealing as a consent order. Nothing else is legal - an agreement or parenting plan is just that - an agreement that can be changed at the drop of a hat if one parent doesn't agree any more.

Don't confuse consent order for CAO with consent order for divorce.

So the first thing to suggest to her is that you agree Child Arrangements - to have that sorted before you move out - has that been discussed at all. Say you'd like to draw up an agreement in writing and have it sealed as a consent order. If you can't agree what it's going to be then you book a MIAM for yourself (maybe don't tell her or she might guess that could lead to a court application). That's a first mediation appointment for information you go to on your own. Attending a MIAM is the legal requirement to meet before you apply to court - if it comes to that.

After that appointment the mediator will write to your ex and invite her to attend mediation. You could mention it first and say you'd like to try mediation to agree the childrens arrangements and someone will contact her.

You might get agreement sorted at mediation for a consent order. Although unlikely if you can't agree between you, but possible. If she says no she's not going to mediation and the children will live with her and you can work out when they see you, then contact the mediator and ask to be signed off mediation. They will send you a completed sign off form (which forms part of the C100 form you apply to court on for child arrangements).

The mediation sign off lasts for three months. So then if no agreement submit your c100 to court for an order for Child Arrangements. But don;t tell her this or she could do something drastic. Again maybe let her know just before she hears about it. After your application is sent the court will send out papers to your ex (and to you) with a first hearing date and anything else they are requesting - that can take 2 to 4 weeks.

Sometimes that is enough to get agreement if she doesn't want to go through the courts and then you might sort it with a consent order.

Meanwhile I think you should say that while you agree to move out when you have found a decent place to live and all agreements have been reached, you would rather just live separately in the same house - and have separate areas of the house meanwhile. So your study could be your room and bedroom and maybe one other room - depends how your house is laid out. So you're separated but in the same house.

What is really important is - avoid getting into any arguments, record everything that is said - don't put yourself at risk of being accused of violence or hostility. Keep diary notes of everything you do with the kids, everything discussed or any incidents that occur.

Change all your passwords straight away (personal email or anything else you don't want her to see). A good way to keep diary notes is email them to yourself - so they're dated and timed. And set up an email folder called Diary notes and put them in there. They could be very helpful evidence at some point. Especially if you're accused of somethign or it;s denied you had any involvement with the childcare. Or worst of all - if she reports you to the police eg. Having them on your email as well means you can access them wherever you are, on your phone (even a police cell).

Hopefully it's not going to be like that but it can get very tense when an ex wants you to go and it is very common for them to make allegations or call the police and get you arrested. The reason for this, if there is no justification, is - if she does her research she will get free legal aid and free lawyers for a child arrangements hearing, if she says she is a victim of abuse. And it also delays processes a long time while it's being investigated - during which time you may not be allowed to see your kids.

So that's the worst case scenario and it does happen.

Yes it's all a lot to take in at once - yes it's your house and jointly owned. But unless you can agree who stays in it until it's either sold, or remortgaged or a longer term plan, it can be tense. It can be less tense if you live in separate areas of the house. You both have a right to be there but if one wants the other out they can apply for an occupation order (which removes the other one). It's usually the Mother who does this as they can say it's the kids home and she needs to be there. That's another reason they can make allegations - to get you out.

In terms of finances - remortgaging to interest only can free up income so one of you can pay rent somewhere else.

I'm no expert on divorce - but you don't need to deal with that yet - get the child arrangements sorted first, then the housing. She can wait for the rest.

What was her attitude to the idea of selling the house and both being able to afford somethign else? Houses are selling fast at the moment. But you still need to secure Child Arrangements. When you're there and seeing them all the time, it's hard to imagine not being able to see them as much.

Have you thought about what you would want? The standard is every other week-end, one midweek overnight and half the school holidays. A lot of Dads want 50/50 shared care/lives with both parents. It helps keep things equal power wise. It doesn't have to be 50/50 = it can still be "lives with both parents" if it's every other week-end and one midweek overnight. But usually the Mother wants to be the "parent with care" who decides everything and have "lives with" her and "spends time with" you. Whatever amount of time you think is workable I would suggest sticking out for "lives with both parents" shared care - it will protect you more in the future (and means you don't need her permission to take the kids on holiday abroad - which can cause issues for some Dads).
 
Last edited:
Back
Top